Mojokane
665 posts
Mar 11, 2013
8:32 PM
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Greetings brothers and sisters!
Kinda beat up...send it to Skip.
item # 160986986441...sorry if spooked the deal for you..
I do already own one, which I am contemplating sending, too.
I have heard, and played through a few stock MA-17's, and the one I presently own has waaaaaaaaay waaaay waaaay too much gain for anything....but guitar. My guitar player pal really wants it bad, too. Sorry bud!
Greg, did Skip finally do yours?
How did he do? I recall you had the same problem.
Was it worth it?
It's like a Kalamazoo Model One....on steroids! eh?
It's a toss up...I want to get over to the mainland to see Rod or Kim at a festival this Summer. Anything shakin?
Thanks in advance.
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Why is it that we all just can't get along?<
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Greg Heumann
2056 posts
Mar 12, 2013
9:40 AM
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Yes, Skip redid mine. I think I posted a pic here together with the 2x10 cab I built for it. It sounds great. I am waiting for a low volume gig somewhere so I can use it!!!
Skip changed the preamp tube setup from 6SJ7 to 6SL7 - I believe these are NOT compatible without some changes. It was still too gainy - but unlike with the 6SJ7 setup, the 6SL7 can be swapped for a 6SN7 which is lower gain. Although it is not as forgiving as a Kalamazoo in this regard it is much, much better than it was in stock trim.
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/Greg
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Rick Davis
1449 posts
Mar 12, 2013
9:50 AM
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Greg, it sounds like your experience with the Masco amp is the same as mine. They have wonderful tone but are just a bit too under-powered for a typical club gig. They are right on that edge. I sold mine to a very good harp player (Dan Solem) who ran into the same issue.
I am not being critical at all. I loved the amp, and I encourage others to try them. But be aware they are not really very loud. They are wonderful for recording and as you say low volume gigs. I sometimes cranked mine up at home just to hear the beautiful tone. It had the deepest harp tone I ever heard!
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-Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
Tip Jar
Last Edited by Rick Davis on Mar 12, 2013 9:51 AM
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TetonJohn
93 posts
Mar 12, 2013
3:02 PM
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Got one of Skip's MA17's just a bit ago. Fortunately, it has been plenty loud enough for me! One gig was just a duo but the first gig was with a 4-piece. I had the single 12 cab pointed toward my left ear (about 5 or 6 ft. away). The guitarist who was to my right asked if I could tilt it out toward the crowd some becuase it was even a bit too loud for him. Tilted toward the crowd some was still fine for my stage volume. It was miked to the PA. I didn't need any in my monitor. Of course that's specific to my band situation, but cab placement and miked to PA got me pretty far along volume-wise with this amp.
(I did try the 6SN7 in place of the 6SL7 and, although I could turn the volume knob up 1 more number, I put the SL back in -- I didn't detect any improvement with the SN -- so far no unmanageable feedback with the higher gain 6SL7.)
Last Edited by TetonJohn on Mar 12, 2013 4:20 PM
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blueswannabe
180 posts
Mar 13, 2013
7:42 AM
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Hi all, I have the 17N. I can't get past Level 2 on the volume control before feedback. Just to clarify, when you say not powerful...I take it you mean can't get higher volumes with harp before feedback. Yes that's true. The masco, however, is plenty powerful, but level 2 is the max for me. I have used it in small gigs and I was told I was too loud. But the masco has nice tone. The bottom end is great and it has nice mids as well as crispiness.
I was contemplating sending my 17N to skip but I was wondering will I gain extra volume sweep or not. If I won't gain extra volume before feedback, I will just keep my amp stock.
@Tenton John, can you share any comparisons on volume level and tone both before and after Skip did your mods.
Last Edited by blueswannabe on Mar 13, 2013 7:48 AM
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6SN7
285 posts
Mar 13, 2013
7:55 AM
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The Masco MA17 is different amplifier from the Masco 17N.
Two completely different animals.
I took a look at what was available on eBay. It looks ok but it will have to be modified to work as a harp amp. It appears to be original.
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Greg Heumann
2058 posts
Mar 13, 2013
8:49 AM
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@JD re: "The Skip Simmons harp amp builds have a wider sweep on the volume control, that doesn't equate more volume before feedback, it means you have a much a less sensitive volume control."
Let me tell you why lower gain (more sweep) DOES give you more volume before feedback. I will use my favorite analogy. Imagine you have a Mazda Miata with a 500HP V8 up front. Now imagine the throttle pedal only moves 1/2". Idle is idle, full throttle is full throttle - but the thing is so hard to modulate in between you have to drive even slower to be safe. Now let's use the same engine but give the throttle pedal 5" of travel. Idle is still idle, full throttle is full throttle, but in between it is much easier to modulate. You will get around the racetrack much faster with this setup.
This is COMPLETELY analogous to how gain affects an amp. Reducing the gain does not increase power, but it DOES change the nature of feedback. Instead of leaping out of the amp at the slightest touch, it comes on more gently and progressively, allowing you to control it with your technique and volume control. For that reason you can actually use more of the amp's available power.
If I need to, I set my amps up so that feedback actually will happen when the mic is at full volume-however it is so easy to control I have the time to get the mic to full volume and play, and knock it back down when I'm done (typically you don't get feedback when you're actually playing).
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/Greg
Last Edited by Greg Heumann on Mar 13, 2013 8:57 AM
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Greg Heumann
2061 posts
Mar 13, 2013
9:27 AM
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JD - I'm sorry you can't relate to it - but it is apt and accurate. Gain is not the same as volume. It is the slope of the curve relating input to output. It is absolutely and 100% NOT the same as using your volume control. It is easy to demonstrate to yourself too. Just take a standard Fender Bassman or equivalent 3 12AX7 amp. Take V2 and V3 out and put 12AU's in there. Don't question whether this is the right setup for you, I'm just making a point. Now instead of feedback with the volume knob at 2 you will get it with the knob at 6 or 7. Instead of LEAPING out of the amp it will come on much more slowly and predictably. So if you don't relate to my analogy that's fine, but this will prove it to you.
I have given this advice to MANY harp players and they have all come back to me with "wow, what a difference".
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/Greg
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TetonJohn
94 posts
Mar 13, 2013
9:33 AM
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@blueswanna Sorry I can't give a pre-Skip comparison -- I bought the amp directly from Skip with his harp build. I think JD provided info though that gets to your question.
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Larry Abela
14 posts
Mar 13, 2013
3:10 PM
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Greg.
Great analogy.
As for chick cars..... I ride a Vespa, my buddy rides a Harley 1200.
We're both compensating......
L
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Mojokane
667 posts
Mar 14, 2013
10:27 AM
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thanks Greg and everybody. It was worth mentioning about the Masco. I was just talking about it with Wes McDaniel last night(fellow gearhead and guitarist).
He stopped by and jumped in for a few.
I'm just scared my Masco will not be loud enough, if I have Skip go through it...right now it's sitting and doing nothing. So I might bust a move soon. Thanks again.
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Why is it that we all just can't get along?<
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Mojokane
668 posts
Mar 15, 2013
1:08 AM
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someone got the Masco for 229.00.
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Why is it that we all just can't get along?<
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TetonJohn
99 posts
Mar 15, 2013
7:35 AM
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JD, that one doesn't have any of that "dragged out of the swamp" mojo!
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6SN7
288 posts
Mar 15, 2013
7:56 AM
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That sucker is gonna need a lot of work....
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