Ahhhhhh.....how should I put this? This thread is getting nasty. My friend Brendan, your rhetorical question containing the word "arse" and directed at 7Limit is flagrantly in violation of the forum creed, and if I don't point that out, I'm guilty of hypocrisy, favoritism, and every other character flaw I earnestly try to avoid. But this sort of language is also entirely uncharacteristic of you.
Rather than getting pissed off, issuing summonses, and locking this thread, I'm going to ask that individual members of this forum give ME a break and, after taking a deep breath, revise their pissed-off, personalized comments/insults in the direction of something like honest disagreement.
Let's not be too sensitive Adam: it's just a bit of banter, as we say over this side of the pond.
To keep things in context, did you read the post I was replying to? It was Cameron (7LimitJI) who introduced the a-word in these pointed sentences:
"Opinions are like arse holes, we all have one. And like arse holes its usually shit that comes out."
He also characterised my opinions as "Bollox". I wasn't offended by the language, as all are good healthy Anglo Saxon epithets that are used liberally in the British Isles. But a robust rejoinder was definitely called for!
I think I did that with taste and some wit. If you check my post I didn't actually call Cameron an arse at all, only using the word in a rhetorical roundabout way alluding to his post. It's a good word, as earthy epithets go. Is it now banned forever?
Since I seem to have upset Blues players, the Brits (and the Scots too apparently!), I might as well be even-handed and have a go at Americans as well :-) In particular the US tendency to euhpemise language for greater blandness. Calling a spade a spade is not one of your strong points. One of the GOOD things about the UK is that public discourse is a lot more open and robust - just check the difference between what is "allowed" on TV here as opposed to there. It's striking.
But we digress from an interesting thread... Where were we? Ah, Howard Levy. Now there's a couple of dangerous words!
I'm delighted that former antagonists are now offering to buy each other beers.
@Brendan: I believe in calling a spade a spade--assuming we're talking shovels here, not black people--but I've learned through painful experience on this forum that the language of direct personal insult quickly renders this place nonfunctional. And the language of tiptoeing-around-the-rules euphemistic not-quite-personal-insult-but-plainly-intended-that-way personal insult has the same effect.
In particular, it forces guys like you and me into the role of kindergarten teacher and student, arbitrating "but he said it FIRST" type disputes. You're quite right: 7Limit went there first. Shame on you, boys!
@7Limit: You're absolutely right. That sort of language always looks worse here.
--He Who Speaks Softly and Carries The Big --ick
IMHO, this thread has pretty much run its course.
Last Edited by on Apr 20, 2012 9:11 AM
Adam I don't wish to stir the pot ;o) but picking up on Brendan's food analogy (and what exactly is wrong with Beans on toast?)
I can understand if you've been raised on a diet of Beefburgers you may not appreciate the culinary delights of Cordon Bleu cookery.
However if you were then informed how the chef agonised over the correct blend of ingredients flavours and textures and 'cheffie' techniques to produce a masterpiece on a plate, you might gain an appreciation of the chef's skills and look at things differently or you might just say impressive, but I still don't like the taste.
Even intellectual musicians will have favourite songs and also the odd one they don't like on a CD, although each song might show the same level of skill and technique.
@Michael.. no vids yet, just a project he was working on in Minneapolis, also if you have heard some of his work on Prairie Home Companion, much more traditional...this one goes almost opposite my point.. more like a howard 10 years ago starting down the path that ricci took up not sure what point the video and related ones make, but interesting to hear him play in this style
this one is pretty darn traditional except for a few of the flourishes, that are only not traditional if you know how diatonic harp is supposed to sound
@ 7LimitJI: I was about to suggest the same thing!
Except let's go to one of your favourite local restaurants and have a chuckle about it over a bottle of fine New Zealand wine :-)
Actually I will be in the frozen north soon, at the Shetlands Folk Festival in early May. But that's probably too far north - where's home for you? Likewise, if you're ever down Canterbury way, drop me a line.
See Adam, nothing to worry about, Cammy and I are old mates by now :-)
Don't kill this thread yet, it's one of the best ever on MBH. It's throwing up lots of interesting stuff that goes to the core of what we like/dislike about music, and bringing people together through mutual abuse. That's what healthy forums are for :-)
I think we need to be careful here, Cam. Since our new-found friendship, this thread is in danger of becoming boring.
I was wondering if we should choose another issue to get narky about, or do you think there is still mileage in the Who-Can-Really-Play-the-Blues question?
Last Edited by on Apr 20, 2012 6:55 PM
1) If one dislikes a performance/record - it's his/her own problem. There's nothing wrong with the music. And a qualified expert can only prove that there's nothing wrong with the music. provided that the musician plays well. Technically speaking.
2) If a musician plays bad - there's obviously a problem with the music, not the listener. AND STILL - there will be some that will sincerely like this.
If you all only knew what sort of musical taste an average Bulgarian person has - your ears would bleed.
Maybe it's time for another thread for all who wish to continue the discussion about what music is what, who plays what and who doesn't, etc. Let's leave Howard alone already. I'm sure he doesn't care a whit about any of this, but really, might we move along now?
OK. I'll have the last word (yeah, right). The main thing "wrong" with Howard is that he - like so many other people, artists and otherwise, who are light years ahead of, or so uniquely beyond, everyone else - can't be pigeon holed, and that drives people nuts. Just like the realities of life that are sloppy, disorganized, complex, confusing, multi-faceted, multi- layered, multi-dimensional, mysterious and un-captureable, we want to make it all simple and explainable and reduceable to small, manageable units of understanding. (It happens in every field of human endeavor, and it's happening here, too).
It can't be done with life, and it can't be done with the kind of phenomenon that Howard represents, so just admit that you're mystified - whether you "like" or "dislike" anything that Howard does is, really irrelevant - and move along.
there is nothing wrong with howard levy. on the contrary, there are so many things right about him it is staggering. the man is brilliant.
he is absolutely the most important player to modern diatonic playing to grace us in the last several decades. without Levy there is no JR, Michalek, Plotnikov,Paclin,Parrott, Carlos Del Junco, etc.. and the list goes on. anyone who overblows is in debt to Levy. MP affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name for info-
Last Edited by on Apr 21, 2012 3:45 PM
@MP You are right--Howard is not the only player on the planet, but he deserves the attention he gets. If he doesn't get a lot of attention here, it is probably because blues is not his main thing. You know, my man Bill Barrett doesn't get a lot of ink here either, and he is much more bluesy than Howard--but again, he plays lots of things that would classified as other than blues, I feel this list focuses on blues musicians (still, Bill is a modern blues harmonica player if there ever was one). PS There might be a BB without HL 8)
Last Edited by on Apr 21, 2012 9:40 PM
Let's go back to the Brenden Powers, Howard Levy Video, Brenden plays from the heart and Howard plays from the head. To me Brenden inspires and I am in awe of Howard but Howard does not inspire me.
@ whistler- why do you say Howard plays from the head? If his music doesn't speak to you, that's one thing, but Howard plays more soulfully than pretty much any other player I can think of. He simply oozes soul. Check out some of the posted videos in this thread and listen to the way he puts his phrases together.
Again, we need to separate personal musical preference from the actual music. I honestly can't understand for a second how someone can not hear the soulfulness and heartfeltness with which Howard plays, even if his music doesn't turn you on. ----------
@sammyharp, I own quite a bit Howards music and enjoy jazz immensely I'm just saying that it is my observation that he is a cerebral player very much the same thing as what seperates a wonderful concert pianist from a great concert pianist, they both phrase beautifully but the great player has fire in his belly.
@jim,thanks I can always count on you to correct any wrong that us mere mortals get our selves into.
After listening to this clip, I can safely say that there is nothing wrong with Howard Levy. This clip has several solos put together, and for me, taken as a whole they show 1) his incredible control and creativity, 2) his genius in taking the instrument out of its idiomatic "harmonica box", but also 3) his relatively less interesting excessivly notey passages.....
I kinda think of Howard as that brave scout that ventured into Indian territory when no one else would and he came back without arrows in his back to show that it was OK.
Remember, Howard was a pianist before a harmonicist. Have you heard his piano playing? It is more amazing than his harmonica playing.
Perhaps he is simply a world class pianist that plays harmonica like a keyboard (for the most part).
Also, he plays for his own amusement, mostly. At that level, he has left most mortals behind. ---------- The Iceman
