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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Is this technology available?
Is this technology available?
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geordiebluesman
148 posts
Mar 04, 2009
2:31 PM
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Hi Harpers, I was walking the dog yesterday and listening to James Cotton on my I Pod, The track was "Bring it on home to me", And i thought to myself, I know i can sing this and i know i can play the harp parts but where can i get a backing track that would fit? Then the thought occured to me, Is it possible to use some kind of electronic Jiggery Pokery to remove the vocal and harp tracks from the song to create the perfect backing track, Does anyone know if this is possible and if so how do i go about doing it, Thanx for any info guys hope to hear from someone soon
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MrVerylongusername
188 posts
Mar 04, 2009
3:32 PM
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I know it's possible with vocals and I'm sure there are programs that will do it. They work on removing whatever is panned dead centre in a stereo mix, so removing lead vocals is usually easy. I doubt the harp will usually be mixed that way, so you probably won't be able to knock it out.
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oda
30 posts
Mar 04, 2009
9:45 PM
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I think the best (highly simplified) answer is: it really depends on how the audio was mastered.
I think we've all thought of doing that one time or another. My generation has been tricked by TV with shows like CSI where the blood tests and finger prints take 8 seconds and you can 'isolate' voices from sound files and cut, and amplify, and all within seconds lol.
there is a feature like thst in the free program 'audacity'
here is the wiki:
http://audacityteam.org/wiki/index.php?title=Vocal_Removal
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geordiebluesman
149 posts
Mar 05, 2009
12:16 AM
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Dear Oda,I downloaded Audacity last night but i don't have a clue how to use it, Do you know of any instructional info available online cos i feel like iv'e borrowed a Porche but can't work out how to open the bleedin drivers door!
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DutchBones
82 posts
Mar 05, 2009
4:37 AM
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Check the internet.. I read somewhere (some time ago) that you can subtract the left channel from the right channel (or the other way around) and what would be left would be the music minus vocals. It does depend though on how the initial thing was recorded (one or 2 vocal mics for stereo if I remember well)
Actually my voice trainer has a "Voice Canceler" which is based on this concept but the result varies from cd to cd, sometimes from track to track..
You should be able to to it with Audacity
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DutchBones Tube
Last Edited by on Mar 05, 2009 4:38 AM
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Jim Rumbaugh
8 posts
Mar 05, 2009
10:03 AM
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georgdiebluesman
I use Audacity every week to record our harmonica club. You can find samples of our work at www.theharmonicaclub.com ,where you can listen to about an hours worth of our jam session.
I am not familiar with any "vocal removing" techniques built into Audacity. An old trick was to take one chanel of the stereo mix, use the invert effect on just one of the two tracks, then remix the 2 chanels. Since the vocal was "usually" the same in both tracks, recombining the out of phase vocals would cancel the vocal out. But there is no guarantee that it will work.
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geordiebluesman
150 posts
Mar 05, 2009
10:54 AM
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Hi Guys, I just wanted to say thanks to you all for replying to my inquiry i have checked out all the links and it looks like i have set myself an almost impossible task but i'm gonna persevere cos it's the challenges that make life worth the effort! PS Jim i'm gonna check out your link at the weekend cos i'm going out on a bender to celebrate the birth of a new little nephew and i won't be fit for anything till saturday!
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Jaybird
70 posts
Mar 06, 2009
11:44 AM
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Hi guys,
First, I'd like to welcome Jaybird803 to the forum, as we can see, this is his first post. I would also like to point out that Jaybird803 is not the same person you guys have gotten to know as "Jaybird" for the past few years, and that would be ME. I hope there will be no confusion on this. "Jaybird803" and "Jaybird" are two different people.
And yes, Jaybird803 is correct that this is one way to solve the dilemma that geordieblesman faces. Yes, you can always hire a band to create your back-up track.
I think that geordiebluesman and myself are on the same track of discovery on how to learn and play the harmonica. Geordie wants to sing and/or play a classic harmonica tune. In this case, it's "Bring it on home to me" by James Cotton. It's a great tune. There are tons of really cool classic harmonica tracks that we have heard and would like to play and perform for others. The harmonica parts are not all that difficult to learn. Intermediate skills are mostly all you need, and LOTS of practice.
Most of us have played along with harp recordings as a way of learning the harmonica. We have the "Amazing Slow Downer" and "Audacity" to change the tempo and pitch of any song. We use it to carefully analyze and listen to the tune, and thereby, learn from it. Once you have "gotten it down" and can play along precisely and at the correct speed, the next logical step is to eliminate the harp and/or voice parts, and make it into a "backup track" so you can perform it for others. That is the dilemma geordie faces.
Unfortunately, this is not easy to do, if at all. There is no "magic bullet" program thats gonna do it. To accomplish the task if at all, you need advanced skills and equipment, and the right source material. As oda pointed out, alot depends on how the original audio was mastered.
With that said, here is my solution to Geordiebluesman's problem. First, collect LOTS of back-up tracks, search through them all and hope you find one that fits. The more tracks you have, the better chance you have. I have over 1700 back-up tracks and still have a difficult time matching one up to an original tune I want to perform. Also, it's an advantage to be able to change the pitch and tempo, cut out or add verses of any recording with the aforementioned tools.
If that doesn't work, maybe you can convince or pay a band to make a recording for you, as Jaybird803 suggested. I have considered this, but never tried it. I believe I would not be happy with the result.
Finally, pick out a song to learn from the Steve Baker playalong series. Steve provides some really cool harmonica solos to learn that already come with the all important perfect back-up track and additional learning materials. Geordiebluesman already has Volume One in the series of three volumes, I believe he wished for and got it for his birthday. He already learned one song so far as I remember him posting, and now he discovered it's the "fast track" method to sounding like pro. Now he wants to do a James Cotton tune, and can't find a suitable back-up track. I know how you feel man. There's alot of William Clarke stuff I know and can play along with, but can't find or make a suitable back-up.
I am not an official endorsee of the Steve Baker Playalong series. I am just a big fan of what he is doing with it. It is unique. Every night before bed, I pray for Volume Four.
Last Edited by on Mar 06, 2009 12:08 PM
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Jaybird
71 posts
Mar 06, 2009
2:10 PM
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You are correct Jaybird803, about what you said and I misquoted you.
Here, in South Florida there are a great number of different "open mics" and "jam sessions" to choose from. Like 20 different venues within 30 miles. I have been to many of these. Frankly, I am absolutely terrible at improvising, which is what you are expected to do at a "jam session", ie. jam along with the other guys. If you want to play a certain original tune, and you want the band to play it "just so" and try to make a recording, you're gonna have a real hard time turning that "jam session" into a "recording rehearsal". Unless or course if you know these guys real well, have played together alot, you might as well form or hire a "band", and make your back-up.
The "open mic" format is different, at least around here. Each "act" gets 3 songs or fifteen minutes to do their thing on stage. You might locate some willing participants to help you at an open mic, but again, you're not gonna turn it into a rehearsal.
The "open mic" format works for me. I get up on stage with my little Micro Cube RX amplifier with a MP3 player connected to it. The stage mic is put in front of the "cube" so the the whole place can hear me. I play my well rehearsed tune along with my perfect "back-up" track.
My back-up tracks are my back-up band. They always perform flawlessly, are never late for a rehearsal or performance, they don't complain, and you don't have to pay them.
My three song open mic set is usually three Steve Baker tunes that I nailed down nearly perfectly. Everyone thinks I am some kinda pro or somethin. I don't tell them I am playing for just three years. hehehe
www.YouTube.com/Jaybird33066
Last Edited by on Mar 06, 2009 2:13 PM
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geordiebluesman
151 posts
Mar 07, 2009
9:31 AM
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Hi Guys, Thanks for the great feed back, I do have an open mike available quite nearby but i'm not ready to perform in public yet, I'm one of those guys who want to be as near perfect as possible before showing his hand in fact most of my mates don't even know i'm learning an instument, Also i had a bad motorbike crash that seriously damaged my memory and this means that i can forget stuff totaly and without warning which makes the prospect of stiffing on stage very real so i'm gonna keep it in the kitchen for a bit longer! PS I'm with Jaybird,Steve Baker Rocks, (But Adam is the guru)
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oda
31 posts
Mar 07, 2009
9:57 AM
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jaybird and jaybird803 are not the same person? you're telling me he's not your alter-ego? because the last 5 or so posts that were an exchange between you two freaked me out.
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Jaybird
74 posts
Mar 07, 2009
5:14 PM
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Yeah oda, I thought my exchange with Jaybird803 looked a little freaky too. But be assured, Jaybird803 is someone else.
And, like Geordiebluesman, I also refused to play for anyone unless I was confident I could do it exactly correct.
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GermanHarpist
126 posts
Mar 08, 2009
10:49 AM
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Ok, now i'm thinking about changing my name to buddha123... lol :)
Btw. I'm selling unplayable Hohner Bluesbands for 99$.
Anybody?
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germanharpist, harpfriends on Youtube
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