Andrew
165 posts
Mar 13, 2009
2:02 AM
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I ask because Scoltx wanted an out-of-the-box comparison of the Seydel Solist Pro and the MB Deluxe, but I gapped both mine after only a few seconds of (laboured) blowing and sucking.
And I wonder if all the talk of customisation is putting people off wanting simply to gap their harps?
I suppose I could resolve to buy a new harp and get used to playing it out of the box, but I don't think I could - I like the gaps closed a little so that the harp responds immediately and sensitively.
So the question is, how many of you play out-of-the-box harps, and how many think everyone should gap every harp to meet their needs (that's my view)?
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Tryharp
123 posts
Mar 13, 2009
4:07 AM
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Well ive got a set of MB's in the main keys used. I mainlny play an A, Bb and C. Play D a bit, G a bit, Eb rarely, E rarely, F rarely. The point to this is that Ive gapped, embossed etc G-C. I recently made a harpfriends vid, which was played on an E harp. I hadnt worked on this harp, and it was a pain in the butt to play, not responsive and stiff. I pulled it apart embossed and gapped the 1-6 draws, which took all of five minutes, and now its a fantastic harp to play the blues ( below 6 that is)
"Take it easy" TRYHARP
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Zhin
146 posts
Mar 13, 2009
4:56 AM
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Guitar players set the action of their strings amongst other things or take it to a guitar tech...
There's no good reason why you shouldn't at least try once on a harp you can afford to lose in case you mess up.
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My Videos
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mickil
73 posts
Mar 13, 2009
6:35 AM
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The long answer:
I'm no great expert - not even a novice - when it comes to altering my harps in any way.
I hear a lot of people on hear say that this or that harp is more responsive than the next one, and I don't doubt them for a moment.
Having said that, I play out-of-the-box Big Rivers, and I suppose it's true that they may take a bit more work than some other harps. Even if they are a bit leaky, I like the sound that the 'hiss' adds to the mix. For me, it's worth the effort to adjust to them.
The short answer:
Well, like people often say on here, it's what you like that matters.
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'If it sounds GOOD to you, it's bitchen; if it sounds BAD to YOU, it's shitty' - Frank Zappa
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Scoltx
39 posts
Mar 13, 2009
7:31 AM
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Actually I replied in that thread that I do some minor tweaks to my harps, mostly gaps, but I don't want to deal with MB nails and unsealed comb. I like the tone of my MB 1896's but I like my Blues Harps because I can take them apart to clean or gap easier. I was kind of hoping that the Seydel would give me a better finished/ playing harp than a Blues Harp or MB with the tone of the MB. The Seydels are about 10 bucks cheaper than the MB deluxe.
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geordiebluesman
156 posts
Mar 14, 2009
10:57 AM
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Hey Tryharp, I was trying to find your video in Harpfriends but could'nt find it could you put a link up on this thread please?
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geordiebluesman
157 posts
Mar 14, 2009
10:57 AM
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Hey Tryharp, I was trying to find your video in Harpfriends but could'nt could you put a link up on this thread please?
Last Edited by on Mar 14, 2009 10:58 AM
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Ant138
71 posts
Mar 14, 2009
1:12 PM
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Im not really sure how to gap a harp, is just a matter of lifting the reeds slightly with a slip of paper? Ive got problems with a Bb marine band, the 3d seems to stick a bit, it also sounds a bit flat on the 1d, should i file a bit of the tip of the reed?
Sorry to deviate from the gapping question but ive been thinking about customising a few harps but i get lost in the technical conversations in this forum.I play out of the box harps but find myself having to buy more expensive harps because im fed up with sticky reeds and general poor quality, i find myself just adjusting to the harps quirks but would rather put a little time into customising.
Just easy things im not massivly technical but there must be a few easy things i can do to a harp to make it play a little better. By the way whats embossing?
Last Edited by on Mar 14, 2009 1:25 PM
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bluemoon
2 posts
Mar 14, 2009
1:54 PM
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I adjust the reed gap on my harps, but only as needed. I have some harps that have played great for me right out of the box and I have never touched the reeds on them. I have some that I needed to adjust one or two reeds to make them more playable, and I have a couple that seemed to need many of the reeds adjusted to make them playable for me. For me, learning how to adjust the reed gap has allowed me to make those hard to play harps much easier and enjoyable to play. It is amazing on how a small adjustment can make a big differance on how well a reed plays, and overall how well the entire harmonica plays.
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Bluzdude46
30 posts
Mar 15, 2009
3:08 AM
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Try taking the oldest most beat up harp you own and sacrifice it. Close the gaps just a little 1-6 put it back together and play it. see if it is more responsive and less leaky. One thing I found is that my harps (which get played alot) last much longer. It makes sense that a harp you don't have to muscle to play is going to last longer. I also find they sound better and I can play with more expression instead of blowing full tilt all the time. It has saved me money and aggravation since I learned to do it. I don't know anything about using paper, I use wooden toothpicks to rub the reed. They don't scratch the reed and I've never had to re-tune afterwards, which I think is a concern to a beginner attempting to work on their harps. You can flatten the reed out, then using your thumb open the tip of the reed to allow it to be played. This is explained better on Overblow.com.
A little gapping goes a long way and after 20 years of playing all kinds of harps out of the box, I haven't found one harp that doesn't play & sound better after gapping.
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Tryharp
127 posts
Mar 15, 2009
4:24 AM
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Geordie,
I put up three, I copied them off Nat Riddles blues TV vid that Adam put up, here they are:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSqOLJaP6Qo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOah8XpgDAA&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otMS4DOKFtU
BTW I loved that promo for your invention you put up, it would have been better with your misses doing the shower scene though, ( dont take that the wrong way )
TRYHARP
Last Edited by on Mar 15, 2009 4:27 AM
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Oisin
143 posts
Mar 21, 2009
7:37 PM
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You know I'm a little confused about gapping and hopefully some of you guys can explain what it is I should be doing.
The first time I ever saw anything about gapping was Adam's video where he took apart a MB and used a piece of paper to lift some of the lower reeds to increase the gap between the reed and the reed slot.
Then I read the posts above and it states you guys are narrowing the gaps. I don't know what I should be doing now!!
What do you recommend?
Oisin
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The Happy Harper
21 posts
Mar 22, 2009
10:46 AM
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Oisin,
here is what folks are talking about, Adam shows you how to close the gap on blow reeds, same thing really for draw, just upside down. or youtube search gapping reeds, lots of vids, or try overblow.com.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBI4otPGdKU
hope that helps.
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Oisin
147 posts
Mar 22, 2009
10:53 AM
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Cheers HH...I'll give that a try.
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The Happy Harper
22 posts
Mar 22, 2009
11:06 AM
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Andrew to answer your question...
"how many of you play out-of-the-box harps, and how many think everyone should gap every harp to meet their needs (that's my view)? "
I think everyone should do what works for them but for me I do only what is needed to make it work well in my mouth, which usually means some gapping (Special 20's). Of course it seems as time goes by my standards for what is needed gets higher and someday I may slave 7 hours over each harp to modify every aspect, but not yet.
For now I just gap the leaky or stuck ones and tune the off ones. That's it. I have replaced reeds as they completely go but only as a last step.
Essentially I play out of the box harps that sound great and won't touch it till it needs help.
Oisin has a good point about gapping. Is it closing or opening the gap? I think 'gapping' is adjusting the gap to suit your needs, so closing it to choke easier or leak less or opening it if it is too closed off.
Others with much more expereince can set me straight but that is what I think.
J
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wailnwillie
1 post
Apr 13, 2009
2:59 PM
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I play Suzuki Pro masters, Lee Oscars, and Bushman and I own some Sp 20s and a Blues Harp. I have had no trouble playing them right out of the box but I like to break them in slow before cutting loose. Seems to break in the reeds (at least to my style). Just switched to some valved Suzuki Pro masters and I love them. I am not use to them yet as you don't have to play as hard. They are by far my favorites. I like Blues harps and Special 20s but I blow the reeds out to easy. I have been playing the same Pro master for 3-4 years and have just now replaced the reeds.(replaced standard reeds with the valved..same fit) But I do not tweek mine.Just replace the reeds when they get fatigued.
Ww
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snakes
180 posts
Apr 13, 2009
3:36 PM
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Well, I've never opened a harp in the year and a half I've been playing. A lot of that has to do with a very long daily commute and having to choose between practicing or tinkering (which I confess I am lame at when it come to using tools). The outcome for me is to take the 20 odd Hohners I've purchased and put them in a separate box for when I am feeling like I have a lot of wind or whenever I do decide to work on harps. For my woodshedding and learning experiences I stick with harps that do play good out of the box (Suzuki's and Seydels). Another benefit I just noticed in my first informal "jam" was that my Seydel and Suzuki were much louder than all of the Hohners in the room. This could have been me or could have been that everyone (fairly new players like me) needed more air for the Hohners as they have not been adjusted. I guess it boils down to I'd rather play 'em than tweak 'em. Call me lame and lazy...
Last Edited by on Apr 13, 2009 3:37 PM
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RyanMortos
141 posts
Apr 15, 2009
6:43 AM
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Ive been using out of the box harps. Im hoping to learn to adjust reeds to play better when they have problems someday. Seems to me outside of seeing someone do it its not an easy thing to learn to do. I would think that gapping where needed should be done. I certainly have harps with difficult to play holes Id like to improve.
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~Ryan
PA
Ryan's Tube - Containing [0] uploads and counting...
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MrVerylongusername
246 posts
Apr 15, 2009
7:59 AM
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I've played out of the box harps of all descriptions for the best part of 20 years. Lee Oskars, Hohners, Suzukis, Bushmans, Seydels. Until I started overblowing, I never felt a need to regap a stock harp. Maybe I'm just lucky?
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chromaticblues
15 posts
Apr 23, 2009
6:26 AM
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I think what harpwrench said is yes.
When doing so try to keep these two things in mind.
First: set the reeds as tight to the reedplate as you can without adversely effecting your playing
Second: try to keep all the reeds straight. Not all of them come from the factory straight! I have found that a lot of reeds will have a slight bend upward. You can remove this by bending the tip down. Then stick a small screwdriver in the hole and gently pry up about 1/4 the distance from the rivet to the tip!
Be careful this is not easy!! The first part is easy the second is alittle nerv racking! Yes I have ruined a reed doing this, but I also have very good playing harps!! At the harps that still work!
Last Edited by on Apr 23, 2009 6:31 AM
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