don't waste your time with anything else. The harpgear comes with badass tone and built by a guy who really knows what he is doing. It's worth the money.
the separates aren't as good and eventually you will hate lugging both units around.
If you MUST get a bassman then 91-94 reissues are good and also the LTD versions but they need to be retubed and the early 90s units don't have tube rectifiers in them.
the only one I own is one of the little 5w amps. It totally rocks. But it's worth saving your money to get something from Brian if nothing else, at least you know that you have the best you can get for harp. So if you have issues with your tone, you can rule out the amp.
My basic philosophy on tone is it only matter to the player. I often play through a little solid state practice amp and the tone totally sounds like shit to me but NOT ONE person has ever complained. Even other harp players. In fact there have been a few harpers that ask me how I get that tone. HA! go figure.
Somewhere on YouTube there's a guy who has made a practice amp out of a little transistor radio by just soldering in a mic socket (it sounds fine), but I can't find it.
The classic '59 Bassman (designed for bass, but used by guitarists) is the one to use for harp. The reissues are perfectly OK, but not as good as an original (very expensive). The 90s reissue (which I have) did not ship with a tube rectifier, but one can be fitted as easily as swapping out a tube. (the solid state rectifier plugs into a tube socket.
A bassman is loud. about 40W of loud. Unless you are prepared to piss off your neighbours and crank it hard, you are not going to get a good tone at bedroom levels. It's a gigging amp - not a practice one.
The 70s Bassmans (Bassmen???) are really for bass only. They are designed to be be very crisp, clean and punchy - not what you want at all.
I've never played through a HarpGear, so I can't comment, but if it's for playing at home, 5W is plenty. You'll get better breakup at lower volume and you can always mic it into the PA if you need to gig with it.
Last Edited by on Apr 27, 2009 3:01 AM
I suggest you and everyone else who are looking into amps read this article first:
http://www.rockdog.com.au/amplifier%20myths.htm
In a nutshell, even a 5 watt amp is punishingly loud at home.
You need to take into account that you want to overdrive the amp just the right amount to get that sweet Chicago break up. You will NEVER be able to get the Bassman in it's sweet operating range unless you are using a huge venue to play at.
I used to carry around a 44 pound Epiphone Valve Special amp with all my harps, mics, and pedals everywhere and it was a nightmare.
And that was merely 44 pounds.
I don't even want to know how heavy the bassman is.
And trust me, the bigger amp ain't gonna make you the bigger player.
Those guys use the bigger amps as a tool. Not because it's a bassman if you follow me. They actually need to push all that air on a big stage.
Nothing screams "newbie" louder than a person who's buying a big amp and hasn't even got regular gigs at large venues yet... and picks a 4x10 40W amp. Sorry, there's no justification for it at all. It's stupid and a waste of money.
Save yourself the embarrassment and get some real research done. Adam has a very nice harp amping lesson you can purchase in his store. It will tell you what you need to know to make the right decision for yourself.
Spend 5 dollars first to find out what you need before you decide to waste hundreds and get stuck with something you can't use and feel frustrated over.
That link is a great article Zhin. Good find. I agree Adam's video is definitely worth buying.
I've edited my original reply - apparently there were some tube 70s bassman amps, but they were still very different circuits from the 50s version. Very clean.
That article and Adam's paid lesson were the most important things for me to learn in order to feel confident enough about harp amplification.
After that it's just trying out wild ideas since I got the fundamentals down (which are easy to learn).
Now I can just focus on having fun with the FX chain and my chops! :D
At any point in time I was not cutting through the mix at a gig, I can can confidently pinpoint the cause. Sometimes it's me not using the PA, sometimes it's the band going overboard, sometimes it's the soundguy who thinks he knows it all. It's never a mystery to me why and that's a good thing. I just need to be more skillful in handling the situations and "obstacles" like power-hungry soundguys.... lol
Though here's a tip... it's a good thing to make friends and be nice to the soundguy. This means, don't argue even if you are right! Coax them instead. You ARE at the mercy of their fingertips!
You got the early 60's Dylan thing where he's mysterious and loves wearing hats. It was a cool thing! I'm a fan jon. That's why I made the reference. It was a compliment.
I'm sorry if that offended you. I'll delete that statement if you'd prefer that.
As someone who has worked on both sides of the mixing desk, that is good advice. Unless they've worked with a lot of blues bands, harp can be a bit of an unknown for a lot of sound guys. Having the understanding of how the PA works, so you can explain to the engineer what you want in language he can relate to is very helpful. Diplomacy is everything. Like you say, some engineers can be quite 'territorial'.
@Jon
If you are not gigging regularly in large venues, then a Bassman or similar boutique amp is overkill. Adam was very enthusiastic about the Valve Junior, it sounds like a really nice piece of kit. If you ended up getting one of those biscuit mics you were discussing, then you've got a cracking setup in terms of amp and mic; you've mentioned getting some custom harps too. Now you've got to work on your own tone.
It's an old chestnut, but a piece of wisdom you will frequently hear is that it is not the gear, it's the player. The overwhelming majority of tone comes from playing technique not gear. To illustrate the point, the drummer in my band is a former pro player. He's settled down to family life now and makes his money giving lessons and gigging with local bands and he's not as well off as he used to be. His old drumkit cost him £80 (about $150) the stands were held together with gaffer tape, odd bits of plastic and woodscrews - in a nutshell it was a piece of shit. It looked awful, when he turned up to audition, we were suppressing smirks amongst the band; until he started playing! The way he played, the way he filled out the whole sound rather than simply keeping beat - quite simply he was the best drummer I've ever played with. It isn't the gear, it's the player. (You should hear what he can do with his new kit!!!)
Gear buying is addictive, harp players seem to be more prone to it than others. Don't get sucked into it!
I have an HG2 and an original 1955 Bassman. They both have great tone. The Bassman is much, much heavier, and it's certainly louder. In order to get a good tone from it, though, I have to crank it up, and that means that I'm LOUD--louder than I need to be in many contexts. And even at that volume I still have a hard time getting a good compression and sustain (a singing tone) on the high notes.
The HG2 gets that sound when I turn it up to 8. 8 is surprisingly loud on that amp--much louder than most people would expect out of an amp that size--but it's not overpowering. This means that in pretty much any context I'm liable to encounter, I can dial in the tone right away without worrying about overpowering people.
I used my HG2 on the street yesterday and the sound was fantastic. I turned it down to about 6.5 and it was still good. I never could have used my Bassman in that context.
The only time I might use my Bassman is if I was playing on a large outdoor stage with a full band (i.e., not with Satan and Adam). In that context, you can treat the Bassman like a smaller amp: you can crank it up to where it sounds great without worrying about feedback or about drowning everybody else out.
Here's video of the last time I dragged my Bassman out of the closet. Big outdoor stage. I was using it in tandem with a Mouse. These days I've shelved the Mouse and would use it in tandem with an HG 2. The sound here is slightly tighter (less sag) than I ideally prefer, and the playing isn't my best, just a slightly groove-wavery bit of shuffle blues. I'm not quite in the pocket on the first chorus. If I'd had an HG2 instead of a Mouse, the tone would have been truly kick-ass:
lol MrV i got sucked into gear buying years ago. i have so much stuff. this is the mic i just purchesed. an just ordered two custom harps an a nice case. i tried making my own case a few times but they never came out the way i wanted.
I bought an HG35 and JT30 from Brian last year and am very happy. The couple of times I've played out with it have worked out pretty well. It isn't so loud that it blows away a jam with my friends, but it is plenty loud enough to throw onstage at a Blues Jam. I played with my friends band for half a set at closing time a week ago and it held up OK on the end of the night loud stuff (including Cold Shot and Too Rolling Stoned). I could hear myself fine but a couple of harp fans asked me to crank it up, so a two guitar band will definitely push it. As I'll play anything for fun but don't plan on doing that often, I'm happier being under 50 watts.
Everyone likes the fine lookin' tweed too, especially guitar players.
I used to own both a Fender Bassman R.I. (one of the original R.I.s) and a 1960 Fender Concert 4x10 amp and both of them kicked ass for harp in different ways. But now from what I'm hearing about the HarpGear, thats what I'm going for next. The question I have about the HarpGear is: How good is the tone when you use the line out option through the pa? Is it as good as it is through the amp itself?
I used to use a '65 Princeton Reverb that was very feedback unfriendly, however I think I've gotten better with my own tone, and playing amplified so I set up better. I've also got a Valve Special which is not great for Harp I play guitar through it now.I have a Valve Jr which I like for very small gigs or practice, A Bogen 33W anp for med venues and a Bassman LTD Re-Issue and swapped out 2 of the pre amp tubes so the line up is 12AU7, 12AY7, 12AX7 The Bassman is by far the Best amp I own or have owned. My opinion only and it could have been the guy playing thru it but the HG50 I heard sounded so boosted on the bottom end it was almost muddy, not crisp at all, but I admit I've never had a chance to actually taste test one myself.
of the bassman type amps, to me, nothing compares to the HG50. Now I've only played through Jason's HG50 a few times but it was enough for me for two reasons. It was the best I have sounded through a tube amp, I know Jason is a complete nut when it comes to tone and amps so I was willing to pass immediate judgment on larger tube amps.
In the past I have owned original 1959 fender bassman 1966 Fender Pro Reverb 1967 Fender Deluxe 1968 Fender Deluxe that was blackfaced 1996 fender Bassman RI 2005 Fender Bassman LTD
I have sold everyone of these amps.
Last Edited by on Apr 27, 2009 1:15 PM
jonsparrow writes: i tried making my own case a few times but they never came out the way i wanted.
A good case can be made with a Leather (Walmart cheap) Laptop case. use 1/4"x2" pine to make dividers and cover them and the bottom with felt. Mine can Hold 21 Diatonics plus has pockets and flaps and zippered compartments for cords, effects box (delay) and a couple of mics. I like mine alot, and I think I spent about $45 US for the case, wood, felt & Super glue. Plus about 2 hours time. Ok I have good ideas but I suck at the hands on craft stuff.
LoL Buddha, I never want to hear Fender say you haven't been a loyal customer over the years. I bought my Bassman right before the Fender increase last month. Seemed like an odd time, economically, for a 20% increase. I heard they did their Guitars a month before that.
I live a few miles from Fender HQ and know lots of guys that work there. Over 50% of bassman sales go to harmonica players. about two years ago I got to the point of talking to them about building a harp specific bassman and champ. This was before the champ 600.
I brought my harp gear amp in to compare to the champ 600 and they were blown away. Ultimately they are doing nothing because it would cost too much to build a good harp amp and the market is not large enough.
They have an awesome studio inside that has nearly every instrument and amp model they have ever made.
I've played through several prototype and even had their version of a custom amp that cost $4500 retail. I thought they had forgot about it because I had it for 7 months. Then one day I got a call and they wanted the amp back. I said I would bring it out and they sent somebody to my house to pick it up. :-(
It didn't sound that great to me anyway but it sure did look nice.
Bluzdude46 ya i made one out of this $15 case i got at a cd store but that one sucked an was way to small. then i made one out of a hair trimmer/buzzer thing case. that one came out pretty good. but i still want something bigger. an id like them to stand up sideways so i just paid for one. fuck it. plus it will hold my bullet mic. its one of the hardcases from cumberland.
As this thread is mostly about amps...I was wondering if anyone is using a fender blues Jr. It is my first amp and I have had it for about a year. I bought it immediately after my first jam session (using borrowed gear)as I was hooked. This was before I found Adam and this site. I use it for practice and a few times a year I jam with some friends. I don't feel I'm getting the blues sound I want. I think the reason is if I turn it up to overdrive, it is just too loud for small living room. It is only 15W but the more I look into this it seems for my use I might be better off with a smaller amp. Comments appreciated.
PS how do you search this forum...I get to the search page but there is no window to enter text??
That was the first time I ever used the line-out feature.
I find that you definately lose out on a real speaker breakup tone. It's slightly on the harsh side to simulate speaker breakup. I prefer the real speaker tone but I am confident enough to go around gigs now and just use the line-out feature.
Overall it's actually really good considering the fact that I don't need to mic it and it cuts through really well. I only had my amp up at 2.5/10 and it was doing well against 4x12 and a badass drummer.
Yes i have FBJ I use it with the band miced up thro' pa At home I dont amplify....learn how to play unamplified first, use hands to wah wah, use tongue slaps and blocks etc and enjoy yourself in the sitting room. Then take your amp to where you can turn it up and work that out....what mic have you got?? Remember this little gem is portable and its all you need (apart from a good woman)!!
@harmonicanik Whew..just finished 2hrs in the wood shed with my FBJ although I do play about half my time unamplified. I think like most people have said on this forum it's not the gear it's the player that makes the sound. I am just starting to get the blocks and slaps to work for me. As for other gear I am using a fairly new shure green bullet mic and sometimes I feed through Boss DD3 delay and less often through a Boss BD blues driver pedal.
@gmacleod Are you uk based? Well done in the shed..it sounds like you are practising hard and above all enjoying it! When you put your toe in the water and play amplified with a bunch of other amped up people then you will face some issues with the FBJ, in that it wont be loud enough, especially if there is a full on drummer. Then you mic up thro' pa. There is very good advice on how best to do this, minimising feedback, further back in this forum.
"Please keep me in front of the mix like the vocalist or I will get drowned out for sure. I'll take it from there to control my levels if you don't mind"
*if you have a volume control of some kind like on a mic, it would actually really help convince them to trust you by just showing it to them.
--
If you are getting too loud:
"Please keep an ear on me and keep my levels down when the other lead instruments/vocalist is doing their thing, and bring it up on top of the mix for my solos"
--
Whatever it is, a good soundguy can make even a mediocre harp player sound fantastic. A bad soundguy who thinks you're cool, will still make sure you are heard.
A good, professional (or professionally minded) soundguy, who doesn't give a crap about you ought to still make you sound good.
Or...
If you've pissed them off they might not go the extra mile for you. But...
In extreme cases they can make you sound worse.
I once worked the desk for a pub rock band. All divas. Thought they were great, but didn't have a clue. I'd ask for mic levels and they'd say "1,2" like that gave me a working volume level. Drummer was a racist idiot. The guitarist and bass would completely ignore my advice on close miking, amp placement and backline. You get the picture. Well I was getting more and more annoyed with each gig we did. Noone ever bought me a drink and the cut I got barely made it worth my time. Then the bass player (falsely) accused me of nicking a bunch of CDs he'd brought in for interval music (he'd left them unattended). I was fuming. That gig I turned his backing vocal UP so everyone could hear how completely tone deaf he was. I took my cut and I quit.
Jon I've looked at a couple of your EBay auctions and think a bassman would suit your style of harp playing well. Mr very long surname is right all reissue baasman have plug in solid state rectifiers. You can replace it with a GZ 34 and it will sound much better. If the 70's amp your talking about is in good shape, plays well and you can get it cheap. Then any good tube amp tech can rewire the tone and driver circuit easily! You should be able to find someone to do it for $100 - $200. I know this because I have done it before and it sounded great!! I build my own amps so I listen closely to peoples sound. AS budda said before fender never really made a harp amp. There a lot of old fenders that work well for harp, but I can take any old amp and make so much better with just a few commons mods and others based on the persons playing style. A couple people already said small amps are the way to go and I to feel the same way. I think every harp player should have a fender silver faced champ with a 10" low watt(10 or 15) speaker with the feedback circuit removed(just one wire) and the 6V6 cathode bypass cap enlarged from 25MF to 47 or 100 depending on your tone and basically which one you like better. That is so easy to do and fender came so close to make the ideal harp amp it isn't funny. The Kalamazoo model one and two speakers are great for this. I build two watt versions(mine has an 8" speaker) that are great for practicing. Anyone out there that has a crappy old little amp that hums like crazy and has three skinny tubes in it. These are the amps I use to build these with. They are very light because most don't have power transformers and use half wave rectifiers. If anyone is interested in building one all Email everything you need to know and then some.(my wife says I have a problem with that! I call it thorough or I can build one for about $250. If anyone is interested I'll try to do a You tube thing, but I have not done that and really don't know how. I'm not trying to drum up business! I'll be glad to send anyone the directions on what to do.
Nick I don't think it's about acoustic feedback. The feedback circuit Chromaticblues is talking about is designed to send a portion of the output signal back on itself, phase inverted, to reduce distortion. It makes the amp much cleaner - killing any powertube distortion. Not what you want in a harp amp.
You need to deal with mic - amp feedback by other means. Good EQ is always the best place to start.
The Harpgear is NOT the ONLY amp. They ARE good amps. But Sonny Jr's amps are also outstanding, Meteor's are great, etc. Each has its own strengths and weaknesses.
The Bassman R.I. simply sucked as far as I'm concerned. It had a plywood cab which I think was part of the problem. Also had a solid state rectifier which was definitely part of the problem. The original Bassman is out the question if you want to buy one unless you have way too much money. But the Bassman LTD is actually a lot of amp for the money and is pretty darn good.
Still if you want to get it to sounds like one of the harp-specific boutique amps, you;ll spend more on tubes, speakers and mods than you would if you simply bought the boutique amp in the first place.
I don't know! I've never had one or worked on one. I did see a very good article on that amp. It stated that they made two versions of this amp. One of them is not very good. I think it is the first few years it was made, but I'm not sure. You can probably find the site I saw. It was only a month or so ago. If you really want the amp I suggest finding a amp tech that is a harp player! Someone that lives close enough were you test it at his house before you leave!! Be Careful sending an amp to someone. The reason I say that is he may think it sounds great, but you may not. After all that have you tried different mics with it yet? I would try a cheap old vocal mic from the 60's or 70's that had high/low impedance switch. I don't know if that amp is cathode biased or not, but if it is put a capacitor about twice the size as the one that is in their! Again that should be online info also. God there's a lot of shit to know just to play a simple little harp you know it!
Last Edited by on Apr 29, 2009 10:42 AM
just got my 1940's brown bullet with black cr element today. MY GOD this thing is screamin! so much louder then my other mics. had to turn the volume down on my amp. sound so awsome. great tone.
Great!! Old mics are cool aren't they. I Use to have an old RCA from the forties that sounded great, but I had feedback problems with it. I was playing in a rock band louddd!!! So I got rid of it. Boy I'd like to have that one back! I'm using a calrad I think it is a DM-11 and I believe you also had one you were selling on Ebay a while ago. Maybe the calrad just works well with my two amps. What did you think of your calrad? Please be honest I'm just curious.
