bluesnut
69 posts
May 07, 2009
1:07 AM
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I have a guy who wants me to play in the key of Ab. The song is Somthing to talk about by Bonnie Raitt. It's the singers key. I cannot get a Db harp to play in 2nd position by this friday. Dose anybody out there know what harp and scale notes or blow/draw holes to use for this song. I own harps in the key of A, Bb, C, D, F & G, all Hohner Special 20s or marine bands.
Last Edited by on May 07, 2009 1:25 AM
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Andrew
284 posts
May 07, 2009
2:00 AM
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You are stuffed unless you can play 2nd position on the D harp down a semitone!
Last Edited by on May 07, 2009 2:00 AM
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GamblersHand
15 posts
May 07, 2009
2:04 AM
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I think the closest you have is 11th position on your Bb - quite challenging to learn in a couple of days!
The tonic/I-chord (Ab) is the 3 draw half-step
the IV chord (Db) is the 4 overblow
the V chord (Eb) is the 5 draw
the III chord (Fm) is the 2d/3b/6b etc
but I could well be wrong - Chris Michalek is the expert here
I think that the song goes up a tone (to the key of B) at the bridge, so perhaps sit out until then before coming in with an "E" harp (2nd), or as you don't have that one, try an "A" in 3rd
hope helps
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Buddha
367 posts
May 07, 2009
5:05 AM
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yep 11th position on a Bb harp is Ab. If you don't know how to play in that position pretend you're playing in 3rd position or 2nd position but in a minor key (flatted 3rd or blue third as gussow calls it)
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Andrew
286 posts
May 07, 2009
7:08 AM
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Do we need to know if it's Ab major or Ab minor?
("Flattened second position" on a D harp would actually be 7th position
"Flattened third position" on a G harp would actually be 8th position, but Ab Major would be the only possiblity, I think.)
Last Edited by on May 07, 2009 7:12 AM
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GamblersHand
16 posts
May 07, 2009
7:20 AM
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Yes it's a major song and again could be talking in ignorance but I think 11th wouldn't be very suitable for minor keys; getting that minor third "B" note on a Bb harp for one thing. And avoiding the 1/4/7/10 blow notes. Though anything's possible.
I think Chris was saying before about flat 3rds was in 11th position to make sure you cleanly hit the half step bend on the 3 draw. A straight 3 draw or quarter tone bend sounds terrible - this is from experience!
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Andrew
287 posts
May 07, 2009
9:32 AM
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That's because 3 draw on a Bb harp is A natural. Not much use in Ab major!
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Jim Rumbaugh
36 posts
May 07, 2009
9:35 AM
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In my opinion, A flat is indeed a singer's key.
No guitar player WANTS to play in that key.
I tell them to raise it up to A or go down to G.
But if you're not the "leader"..........hmmmmmm
Maybe that's why "proffesionals" have lots of harps.
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Preston
325 posts
May 07, 2009
12:10 PM
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I was under the impression that several guitar players liked tuning down half a step for a deeper/richer sound. They actually pick the strings for the key of A, but the strings themselves are tuned down so it plays Ab. Therefore they aren't exactly "Playing" Ab, it just produces that sound.
So if a harp player wanted to play with more of a rock band and not so much of a blues band, would it be beneficial to own the flat keys as well?
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bluzlvr
183 posts
May 07, 2009
1:03 PM
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It does pay to have all the keys. I've got a Db harp, but it's staying pretty pristine. I do like the way it sounds. Like Preston says, some guys like to tune down a half step ala Stevie Ray Vaughn.(How much harp do you find on SRV's records?)
The other day I was jamming along to Kim Wilson's CD "Tiger Man" and noticed he was using the Ab harp an awfull lot.
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Andrew
289 posts
May 07, 2009
2:57 PM
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I was talking crap when I said
"Flattened third position" on a G harp would actually be 8th position, but Ab Major would be the only possibility, I think.
I wasn't calculating carefully and imagined that a 1 overblow would come into Ab minor, but actually it would be the 2 blow, so that's OK.
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bluesnut
70 posts
May 08, 2009
4:45 PM
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Wow lots of info to soak in. I will be ordering an Ab harp so i can play in 2nd position. how long have you all have been playing? This is over my head. I'll ask them to move a half step.
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Greg Heumann
29 posts
May 08, 2009
9:59 PM
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I carry a full set of harps. If you want to play, you better be ready to play. I am a singer too, and there are some songs that really test my range. Sometimes I HAVE to choose a key right down to the half step. If you want to play, you better be ready to play.
I use Special 20's in the keys I don't play often. Keeps the cost down.
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/Greg
http://www.BlowMeAway.com
http://www.BlueStateBand.net
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Andrew
293 posts
May 09, 2009
12:35 AM
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bluesnut, "I will be ordering an Ab harp so i can play in 2nd position."
You either mean Db/C# or you mean 1st position.
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MrVerylongusername
300 posts
May 09, 2009
7:04 AM
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On the subject of guitarist tuning down a half step - I have heard at least two separate guitarist tell me they do it to throw harp Gus's from wanting to come and jam with the band.
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Greg Heumann
31 posts
May 09, 2009
7:40 AM
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Preston is right - guitar players often tune down a half step. This allows them to use a fatter string and still be able to bend notes. Albert Collins was a prime example. So were Stevie Ray Vaughan, T-Bone Walker, Albert King, and more.
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/Greg
http://www.BlowMeAway.com
http://www.BlueStateBand.net
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