ZackPomerleau
222 posts
Jun 19, 2009
6:36 PM
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What is going on lately with the attacking of certain members, including myself when we post videos or try to help? SEVERAL people here are getting idiotic attitudes pointed towards them and it is not right. What's with you guys? If you don't like certain music, someone's advice, general comments, playing, or anything, just leave it be.
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nacoran
65 posts
Jun 19, 2009
7:40 PM
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I agree, sort of.
Everyone is going to have their own opinions. The trick to critiquing a performance is to be very specific about what you like and don't like about it. Don't just say something sucks and don't attack the performer. I've got to say, I've avoided putting my stuff up here because I don't think I'm at a point yet where I'm not seeing all sorts of things wrong with it myself. People can critique something very thoroughly and still be nice and supportive. It's harder work to offer constructive criticism than just tearing something down.
You seem to not be calling people out by name, which has it's advantages, but don't be afraid to say something right after the offending comment. We've got a lot of different skill levels represented here. The superstars need to remember how they played when they first started, but us newbs need to remember that if people just tell us how great we are we'll never learn anything.
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ZackPomerleau
225 posts
Jun 19, 2009
7:52 PM
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The huge issue with me was with someone going all wacko on the fact I wrote out a scale for some guy. That was uncalled for, and yes, I didn't use names for good reason...
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jonsparrow
471 posts
Jun 19, 2009
7:53 PM
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i think i missed something.
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nacoran
67 posts
Jun 19, 2009
7:59 PM
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I must have missed that thread. That sort of stuff happens on all web forums. It's like the people who go into threads and type, 'First'. Just remember, if they are typing on the web at least they aren't out annoying someone in real life! And it's easier to ignore someone on the web.
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Preston
429 posts
Jun 19, 2009
8:15 PM
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Zack, I've read the other posts tonight, and it looks like you are chasing Philosophy through a couple of unrelated threads for his opinion on "pretentious wanker music".
"If you don't like certain music, someone's advice, general comments, playing, or anything, just leave it be."
I think this is, ironically, very good advice that you are not following yet.
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ZackPomerleau
227 posts
Jun 19, 2009
8:20 PM
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No, that is not what I am going on about, although that is one good reason why I should be.
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Kingley
60 posts
Jun 19, 2009
11:50 PM
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There will always be people who disagree with others and some people take offense when they suffer criticism. Constructive criticism is very helpful to all people, whether they are a beginner or a professional.
A personal attack on someone however is not criticism. It's bullying, and as such should be abhorred and brought to light. Along with sexism and racism.
I may disagree with peoples comments sometimes, but I wouldn't say they are wrong, or insult them personally. As they are just expressing a different point of view.
My view is that an open mind is a good thing. You can't learn from a closed book.
Last Edited by on Jun 20, 2009 12:20 AM
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harmonicanick
305 posts
Jun 20, 2009
1:26 AM
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@jonsparrow
'heh...wanker. english people'
Hey Jon, remember where most of you 'yanks' come from originally please!
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Blocker
6 posts
Jun 20, 2009
6:09 AM
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Hey Zack, good on you for taking people to task over insulting comments. Kingley is quite right in stating that a personal attack is in fact bullying and should be challenged.
I think what you may be referring to was the “puppet strings” comment made about you a while ago, which I believe was very harsh way of putting things; however I think you were maybe the innocent bystander caught up in some bad feeling between one of the respondents toward the other. I thought the way you handled it though showed a great level of maturity.
I think everyone needs to reflect on what endeavour they are trying to achieve and encourage constructive criticism from others (constructive being the operative word). As it’s the only way to truly grow and improve. One of the pitfalls of a forum such as this however, it that the written word can easily be taken the wrong way if the context in which it is meant is not adequately explained.
Anyway good on you for sticking up for yourself, and please keep sharing your harp knowledge as I for one really appreciate it.
ps
Sometimes people really are just wankers and its best just to think it, and then leave it at that.
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ZackPomerleau
228 posts
Jun 20, 2009
6:46 AM
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Thank you Blocker! I am glad you appreciate it, I love to help you guys out. And yes, that was a big part of it. Funny though, that guy can't speak up.
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addict
2 posts
Jun 20, 2009
9:27 AM
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I was hoping to find some harmonica buddies and food for thought here... guess not.
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jonsparrow
473 posts
Jun 20, 2009
10:17 AM
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nick im just playin.
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Philosofy
225 posts
Jun 20, 2009
11:04 AM
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"Thank you Blocker! I am glad you appreciate it, I love to help you guys out. And yes, that was a big part of it. Funny though, that guy can't speak up."
You're not talking about me, are you? I've got no problem with you at all, and don't think I've done anything to you.
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eharp
261 posts
Jun 20, 2009
11:38 AM
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addict- stick around.
as they always do, this tempest will soon blow itself out and things will go back to normal. it is usually friendly around here. and some of these guys have bits of knowledge which you may find helpful.
remember-just for today, i will believe in somebody who wants to help.
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mickil
258 posts
Jun 20, 2009
12:07 PM
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ZackP,
This kind of thing happens regularly on here; you can almost set your clocks by it. Just ignore it, unless you enjoy the fray.
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'If it sounds GOOD to you, it's bitchen; if it sounds BAD to YOU, it's shitty' - Frank Zappa
http://www.youtube.com/user/SlimHarpMick
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nacoran
71 posts
Jun 20, 2009
12:44 PM
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'Wanker Music'- Cool, now this site has it's own internet meme! Maybe we can put it on the T-Shirt!
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jonsparrow
475 posts
Jun 20, 2009
1:03 PM
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these arnt fights. these are disagreements. you guys should see how people act on other forums. this is probobly the calmest forum i ever seen. on other forums people be like "fuck you go kill you self your retarded if you think thats that" etc...
yall need to lighten up. not every one in the world will think the same opinions. an i believe every one has the right to express there opinions. if there rude about it, that just means there a rude asshole. an thats them. deal wit it. i dont even know what you guys are talkin about.
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eharp
264 posts
Jun 20, 2009
1:39 PM
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"on other forums people be like "fuck you go kill you self your retarded if you think thats that""
but that is the "ihatetheworld.com" forum.
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mickil
259 posts
Jun 20, 2009
1:39 PM
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Probably the same reason that you are. Just human nature, I suppose. I'm gonna pour another glass now. Cheers!
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'If it sounds GOOD to you, it's bitchen; if it sounds BAD to YOU, it's shitty' - Frank Zappa
http://www.youtube.com/user/SlimHarpMick
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KingoBad
42 posts
Jun 20, 2009
2:26 PM
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Maybe I'm just anal, but shouldn't the title of this thread be "I'm calling someone out," or "I'm calling you out, and you know who you are..."
Maybe it's me, but the finer points of calling someone out entail naming the parties to throw down. We seem to have an open challenge to a not to be named "you know who you are" person who perhaps should be left as nameless as the challenge should have not been made in the first place.
If your honor has been offended, offer your challenge and toe the line. Otherwise, let it blow over as all of these petty squabbles do. If you are looking for support from the rest of us - which is the only reason a thread like this can be about, then do that. Just don't throw down the gauntlet and not name the man who should pick it up. It is grandstanding and a waste of time and effort.
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eharp
265 posts
Jun 20, 2009
2:36 PM
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i sat in the grandstands for a race once. it wasnt very grand and we were usually sitting.
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ZackPomerleau
230 posts
Jun 20, 2009
8:57 PM
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Philosophy, not you. someone else.
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jonsparrow
477 posts
Jun 21, 2009
12:31 AM
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speak on that shit. if you callin some one out call em out.
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kudzurunner
516 posts
Jun 21, 2009
4:39 AM
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Keep it calm, boys. This forum is calm because His Royal Pain in the Highness isn't afraid to crack the whip on rare but salutary occasions.
Please remember the board creed. Most of you are pretty good about this.
I haven't been following whatever thread Zack is responding to, but please rememeber (and this doesn't just apply to Zack): when you post a video and ask the entire board community, "What do you think?", you should be prepared to hear what people have to say--including, and especially, people who strongly dislike it. Ideally, people will gentle-down their negative opinions, but this is the real world and not everybody on this board is a trained therapist or social worker. (Chis tends to be more blunt than me, for example. I'm a college professor; he trains attack dogs. Undergrads can give me negative evaluations if I don't make nice. Attack dogs NEED to be whipped into line.)
I'll say something here that I haven't said before: I think it's risky to do what Zack did, and what many others here have done, which is ask for general reactions. Some people are almost sure to have negative reactions, strong critiques, even very very strongly negative (sometimes skewed or idiosyncratic) reactions based on their own very specific musical likes and dislikes.
One reason why people get teachers, as opposed to soliciting general reactions, is that teachers can be trusted: their perspective, their wisdom, their knowledge. Teachers, coaches, etc. And even then, problems can crop up and relationships must sometimes be ended.
This forum has about 800 members. If you're going to post videos and soundclips of your own playing and ask for general reactions, it's best to cultivate a perspective: "I'm soliciting information" rather than "I'm seeking approval and constructive criticism." Some information--i.e., strongly negative reactions--can be useful, rather than painful, if you're able to reframe it. Sometimes the negative reactions contain useful information.
Meanwhile: The board creed requests NO personal attacks of any sort. But when people solicit general responses to their own videos & mp3s, people need to be able to speak freely about what they actually hear. Let's try to find a balance between constructive and honest. But I refuse to play school-marm or sheriff in such circumstances--unless, of course, people use the phrase "mind-vomit," in which case Big Nanny here is GOING to get pissed off.
Last Edited by on Jun 21, 2009 8:46 AM
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Buddha
674 posts
Jun 21, 2009
8:08 AM
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I actually like the term "mind-vomit" for when people start spewing non-cogent crap. Everybody does it and it usually stops when it's pointed out.
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kudzurunner
517 posts
Jun 21, 2009
8:45 AM
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True.
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sopwithcamels266
121 posts
Jun 21, 2009
8:59 AM
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Buddha : Me too I like that never heard it before until I read it on this forum. Thats what MBH is all about, love it.
Yea most of us spew it out at times, I do for sure but sometimes in amongst the "mind- vomit" there are some interesting chewy bits ha ha.
Actually that is going to put me off my tea having a vivid imagination.(In Uk it's tea time which today consists of me doing fish and meat dishes for everyone in the back garden)
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ZackPomerleau
232 posts
Jun 21, 2009
9:17 AM
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Adam, thank you, but not the issue. When you are insulted because you hand out musical knowledge I think that's idiotic. But, it makes me laugh because a grown man taunting a young kid is more childish than I could be. At least I wanted to help with music theory, as I think it is VERY important.
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eharp
270 posts
Jun 21, 2009
11:50 AM
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"young kid"?
that makes me think of 10 or 11.
if you want to play amongst the grown men you must be prepared for when we act like young kids; in all aspects! lol!
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Elwood
77 posts
Jun 21, 2009
3:19 PM
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Kudzu: Actually, Zack's complaint isn't about feedback he got from a video. His contribution to a technical thread was quite aggressively challenged by a third party -- so it wasn't quite a case of his putting himself out there and then yelping when he got trod on.
But as so many have said, it's old news. Zack, I reckon you're big enough not to be bothered. Your playing is great, you're respected on this forum -- so you can probably shrug it off.
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wailing
1 post
Jun 21, 2009
3:19 PM
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nice first day of summer.
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