Buddha
1015 posts
Sep 23, 2009
9:08 AM
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I'm not sure what to think of this swine flu business. In general its a component of fear mongering to keep people in control.
I was going to go back to MN this weekend but my mother called and said my Dad and brother are very sick with swine flu. My dad was totally healthy last week but last friday his hospital made everybody take the flu vaccine and now he's extremely ill. This is not good.
My wife told me this morning that her mother just called to say that my wife's sister, brother in law and two nephews have the swine flu too.
Any of you guys know anybody with this?
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"The truth may hurt for a little while, but a lie hurts forever."
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ChrisA
78 posts
Sep 23, 2009
9:22 AM
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Sorry to hear that. Up here in Canada the government is preparing for vaccination on a large scale as they are now talking about pandemia.
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Kingley
363 posts
Sep 23, 2009
9:28 AM
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"In general its a component of fear mongering to keep people in control."
I agree totally.
As for the flu vaccine. As you are no doubt aware it works by giving the person a small dose of the disease to attempt to encourage the body to develop an immunity to the full blown disease.
However it's pretty well documented that a small number of people cannot tolerate the vaccines and then develop a more severe version of the disease in question.
I do not know anybody who has or has had swine flu.
Chris, I hope your dad makes a full and speedy recovery.
Last Edited by on Sep 23, 2009 9:30 AM
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Buzadero
150 posts
Sep 23, 2009
9:42 AM
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Clearly, I'm in no position to offer anything but informed opinion. But, caveat aside, I am cursed with a family filled with both physicians and attorneys (yes, the Thanksgiving table can get lively). I have recently asked my peeps as much as I could about this "Swine Flu" thing. The general concensus is that flu is flu. It comes around in various strains and incarnations every year. It all starts from birds and/or pigs. Thus, if you call it "bird flu" or "swine flu" you are accurate, depending on the year.
Each season's variety is stronger or weaker than the last. As we move through life, each person's body and system develop resistance to the various strains that you have been subjected to over your life. Thus, if I was 10 years old and came down with the ABC123 version. And, some 20 years later a slightly different, but very close characteristics version of this same strain comes around, I will have an easier time with this one. This current "swine flu" (H1N1) is effecting young people and kids more drastically than adults, because nothing with characteristics like this one has come around during their lifetimes, so they don't have any of the antibodies (?) that they need to fight it. That means they have to suffer the full brunt. Of course, it is also possible that an adult that managed to miss the versions that share the same characteristics as this one every time they came around, will suffer just as hard as a kid.
Do we take it lightly? No. But, unless I notice an inordinate amount of people that I know dropping dead, I'm going to treat this one just like any other hard-hitting version of the same old "flu".
The above not withstanding, I have noticed that exposure to the media tends to aggravate the symptoms.
Your results may vary.
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~Buzadero
Underwater Janitor, Patriot
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Ant138
131 posts
Sep 23, 2009
9:49 AM
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Two people at my work (wales,u.k.)have come down with it. from what i can gather its just like regular flu but can be worse for people with an underlying health condition. hope your family members get well soon.
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harmonicanick
381 posts
Sep 23, 2009
9:55 AM
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The UK medical authorities have forbidden patients with flu like symptoms from attending their Doctors surgery and set up a 'flu line' in place where people phone through their symptoms and the hastily employed 'advisors' tick boxes to questions and then if swine flu is alleged then you send a 'flu friend' to pick up some 'tamiflu' which is 'supposed' to alleviate the symptoms.
This approach has resulted in the wrong diagnosis in a number of cases.
'Tamiflu' apparently has very little effect.
I understood that the they had not got to the stage of releasing a fully tested vaccine yet Chris, but maybe thats different for you in the states.
Hope your family make a speedy recovery.
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harpcrab
21 posts
Sep 23, 2009
10:04 AM
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Buzadero- good summary.
Sure, there's alot of media hype about it, but when there is a particularly virulent new strain of an influenza virus, it leaves the potential for very bad consequences for a lot of people. I'm certainly not chalking it ALL up to just being media hype. We have very limited ability to treat viral infections. Google "1917 influenza pandemic". Back then it was spread by troops returning from WW1. Today the world is a much smaller place with air travel. It will happen again at some point- maybe not this time ??? but it will happen again.
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Buzadero
151 posts
Sep 23, 2009
10:05 AM
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Just make sure you wash those custom harps before you ship. Nobody wants your Buddha strain. Ick.
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~Buzadero
Underwater Janitor, Patriot
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MrVerylongusername
524 posts
Sep 23, 2009
10:12 AM
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I have a friend who is a locum pharmacist. at the height of the last wave he said he was regularly turning people away. He said the conversation usually went like this:
"I think I've got swine flu, what can I take"
"Have you ever had regular flu?"
"Yes"
"What was it like?"
"I had terrible aches and shivers, vomited a few times and couldn't get out of bed"
"Swine flu is like that too"
"Ah"
"So you made it into town to come here. Still think you've got it?"
"Hmmm"
[Sheepish exit]
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Jim Rumbaugh
85 posts
Sep 23, 2009
10:15 AM
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Saturday I played at The Ohio Valley Championship
Sunday the flu struck
what did I eat Saturday...... pork .... hmmmmm.(swine flu?)
I'm OK now, maybe it was just food poisoning????
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XHarp
174 posts
Sep 23, 2009
10:37 AM
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Buddha, Hope everyone is feeling well soon. Not good for the elderly to get really sick. Its always harder for them to recover.
My wife's been home in bed sicker then a dog eating grass.
Low grade fever, cough yada yada yada...
Based on the media storm, we get to thinkin' last night, swine flu. She goes the to doctor today and the conversation kinda goes like the one noted by Mr.verylongusername and finds out its bronchitis bordering pneumonia.
Doc says, swine flu is overblown by the media but if it does hit, the issue will be young children and elderly. Hence the reason they're getting vaccinated first.
I'm agreed on the media thing, we were in Mexico the week swine flu broke out and low & behold, so were about 50,000 other vacationers. A few people caught it surely, most didn't. But if you listen to the media, we were to close the doors, shut up the windows and batton the hatches for the impending doom.
If they keep with calling wolf, I wonder what's going to happen when we really do get the impending doom? Like when the SARS thing hit the big smoke. We all learned a big lesson dealing with that but did all other countries watch and learn too?
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"Keep it in your mouth" - XHarp
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BillBailey
9 posts
Sep 23, 2009
10:58 AM
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Did lab results from a nasopharyngeal and/or oropharyngeal swab confirm novel influenza type A (H1N1)? The viral shed is up to seven days. Good decision to stay away. No flu is fun---and both the seasonal and novel type A this year are rough ones for kids and the frail elderly. The media does arm-flap too much, but some folks are going to become very ill this year---BTW, cases are way up for this time of year.
Anti-virals can help marginally and are generally worth the effort early-on. I wish all a speedy recover.
It's important to remember the vast majority of flu infections are NOT H1N1---thus more physicians don't test the nourished, healthy for H1N1.
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lumpy wafflesquirt
113 posts
Sep 23, 2009
11:11 AM
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I had an emial saying you can get it from tinned pork.
.
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.
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I decided it was SPAM
:^)
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dfwdlg
61 posts
Sep 23, 2009
11:40 AM
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My wife got a call from the wife of a local doctor yesterday. She said if your kid gets the flu make sure the Dr. gives them antibiotics Many of the deaths are due to secondary bacterial infections.
Better safe than sorry.
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nacoran
198 posts
Sep 23, 2009
12:08 PM
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The vaccine is made with dead virus. If you get sick 'from the vaccine' you already had been exposed somewhere else. (You can get an infection from any needle stick, so make sure your doctor swabs the area down well.) Different strains of flu are stronger or weaker than each other. Swine flu theoretically is a severe one that spreads particularly easily. Still, the people it's going to hit hardest are the ones flu always hits hardest, the old and the really young. Flu can always be dangerous if you are already weakened. Get the vaccine. Unfortunately, studies show that flu shots work OK the first year you get them, but really shine when you get them in consecutive years, so if you didn't get one last year you'll only get partial protection. It's a virus, so antibiotics won't help.
Dfwdlg- I've never heard of doctors using antibiotics that way. It's seems from what I know about antibiotics that is a bad idea. It's why we have so many antibiotic resistant bacteria out there. If they kids get a secondary bacterial infection, then treat them, but treating them with antibiotics before that seems to be contrary to everything I've read about preventing antibiotic-resistant strains of bacteria. Lots of doctors give out antibiotics like candy. If my doctor wanted to put me on antibiotics for the flu I'd want them to point me to a study that suggests that is a reasonable idea.
Don't share your harps!
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snakes
352 posts
Sep 23, 2009
12:08 PM
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I work for a very large medical organization. Granted I am an IT guy, but I support systems for clinical applications. My organization (which has more than one hospital and many clinics) is taking this flu very seriously. It seems to have mutated with an avian flu as well as a swine flu. What does that mean? Essentially that it has all the potential to be very virulent or contagious if you will. I know of one person in my circle of friends who was diagnosed with H1N1 and he missed 7 days of work. There have been a handful of deaths from it in my area, but most of those were because the infected person had a secondary condition such as asthma or diabetes. As for the shot you are given a dose of the bug (so to speak), but it is dead and so should not give you H1N1. Your body reacts to the dead bug by creating antibodies for the live one. Personally I'd recommend getting the shot if you are at risk like me (I have asthma). I can respect your choice to not get the shot as I refused for years. I've received a flu shot for the last couple of years and had no problems with any symptoms afterward.
You don't get swine flu from food and unless you have a secondary condition to worry about or fear a bronchitis-like sickness I would not recommend the antibiotics either. I am not a doctor though and I'd follow your doctor's advice over mine.
As for cleaning the harps - I am counting on Buddha cleaning mine before sending it to me, but it has nothing to do with swine flu worries and everything to do with a normal practice.
Last Edited by on Sep 23, 2009 12:08 PM
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Blackbird
115 posts
Sep 23, 2009
12:13 PM
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I've met a co-worker or two who had confirmed cases of it, they came back after a week lookin' rather taxed by it, and said it was hell as flu goes. I tend to agree with Buzadero, though. Flu is flu is flu, and some people aren't built well to handle it. Me, for example, am prone to very serious respiratory ailments, and those are bad enough, so with a dose of flu, I'm probably one of the guys who's gonna take it badly because it'll be compounded by other problems that flu will naturally make difficult.
That being said, I'm wearing lots of condoms and keeping my needles real clean! (www.instantrimshot.com)
Hope anyone with it recovers quickly - even non swine flu is a bad time.
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scstrickland
251 posts
Sep 23, 2009
12:31 PM
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SARS, Mad Cow, Avian Flu, E-Coli poisoning, MRSA, Swine Flu = 24 Hr news channels competing for your attention.
Your commute to work is more dangerous than anything listed above. Heart disease is still the #1 killer in the U.S. but these thing don't keep you tuning in hoping to get the "all clear" that will never come. Next year there will be a new disease.
Last Edited by on Sep 23, 2009 3:08 PM
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Aussiesucker
362 posts
Sep 23, 2009
5:20 PM
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Most of you guys are heading into your flu season wheras we have gone through ours.
Personally I think it a bit of a beat up ie it proved to be no more of a threat than normal flu is each winter. That said I think most would have taken more precautions as we were being told to do so.I make sure I get a flu jab each year and hopefully by our next flu season you guys will have tested and perfected the swine variety. Still another variety will be set loose.
As I age I find that my susceptability to getting flu and colds is not as frequent, but when I do then it is a lot worse than it used to be with complications ie respiratory, asthmatic, bronchial problems that take a long time to recover from fully. I think the multiple doses of different antibiotics fix the immediate problem but damage the immune system.
Wonder what new diseases the giant pharmaceutical companies will release into the atmosphere next? Am I a cynic - you bet!
Last Edited by on Sep 23, 2009 5:23 PM
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DutchBones
292 posts
Sep 23, 2009
10:38 PM
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We have a total of 17 dead people here in Japan because of the swine flu, ranging from 7 up to 76 years old, from people who had already some sort of illness up to perfectly healthy people and it's getting worse....
you ask me? yes I take it serious .... and traffic accidents... well thats maybe a killer, but it is also plain stupid and avoidable if people REALLY tried....
Chris, I hope everybody in your family well get well again as soon as possible
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DutchBones Tube
Last Edited by on Sep 23, 2009 10:40 PM
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scstrickland
253 posts
Sep 24, 2009
1:45 AM
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Deaths from N1H1 = 2,837 wold wide in 2009
Deaths from HIV/AIDS = <2,000,000 world wide in 2009
just some perspective.
Last Edited by on Sep 24, 2009 1:46 AM
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Bluzdude46
201 posts
Sep 24, 2009
3:03 AM
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haven't gotten a flu shot in 25 years I'm really never sick. but now that they've diagnosed me Diabetic they say I gotta do flu shots both regular and swine. Chris I hope your people make out ok.
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arzajac
47 posts
Sep 24, 2009
4:18 AM
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It's not fear mongering. There is a real difference between the regular flu and H1N1.
You would not put an 87-year-old lady on a heart-lung machine for a week to let her recover from the flu - she would not be likely to survive the complications of being on the machine. A young person would.
This means that your health care system will have its resources drained.
Although H1N1 may not affect as many people as other diseases (or even other strains of the flu) it will be much more resource-intensive per patient since they are young patients. It costs a lot of money, takes up a lot of time and requires a lot of equipment to treat a patient in the Intensive Care Unit, not to mention patients who require even more invasive support.
In turn, for most health care systems, this will mean fewer beds and people available to treat the rest of the population.
Yes, wash your hands a lot, but don't underestimate H1N1.
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Andrew
623 posts
Sep 24, 2009
7:38 AM
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What I know of the Spanish Influenza of 1918 is that it is now known to have originated in the hospital at Etaples and/because it was preceded by a much smaller outbreak there in 1916, both identified by the main symptom heliotrope cynanosis. What seems to happen is that viruses come out for a practice run then go into incubation for a couple of years and mutate into something far stronger. So even if this swine flu outbreak is minor, it doesn’t mean there won’t be a biggie in two years’ time.
If you can catch something mild now, that might stand you in good stead.
Last Edited by on Sep 24, 2009 7:38 AM
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phogi
33 posts
Sep 25, 2009
3:48 AM
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I saw this on the news the other day:
"The world is ending, we are all going to die!"
I was taken aback for a minute, then I realized that they said the same thing yesterday, the day before, and the day before, etc... And that is what the news said every single day for the entire duration of my life.
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ness
57 posts
Sep 25, 2009
5:59 AM
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Sure, the media is making a big deal outta this, but they do about everything!
That said, it still makes sense to take precautions. And don't think if you're middle aged you're immune -- it's just that the odds are in your favor. I had a 40-something, healthy co-worker die from the flu a couple years ago -- so it does happen.
Around here -- mid west USA -- there have been a lot of problems this year, earlier than usual (cold, flu, bronchitis, pneumonia, sinusitis, etc.) so it may be an interesting year.
For me personally, it's been a roller coaster of sinus/ear infections and then shingles. No fun at all, especially the shingles.
Chris -- good luck with your folks!
Last Edited by on Sep 25, 2009 6:00 AM
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walterharp
67 posts
Sep 25, 2009
7:22 AM
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I say take it seriously. The news drums up news, but the experts say if this is not the one, it is only a matter of time.
1) The rate that flu spreads is faster than ever in our modern world, during the Spanish Flu epidemic it originated in Kansas and spread to Europe via troops in ships. The current swine flu spread around the world in a matter of weeks.
2) Our immunization production facilities take about a year to put anything out, cause they don't have enough egg production to culture the virus that they kill (for injections) or weaken (for intranasal) for immunization.
3) My friend from south america said that H1N1 shut cities down as it swept through. Schools closed, not enough health workers, pretty disruptive. It has not been winter here yet which is the condition when the disease spreads most rapidly.
4) Get your regular flu shot now, because you cannot take the swine flu shot with less than a month between the two.
5) that drunk guy who wants to play your harp... all the more reason to say no.. "dude I think I might be coming down with swine flu." :-)
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Buddha
1018 posts
Sep 25, 2009
9:03 AM
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My dad was "forced" to take the vaccine a week ago. Everybody in his dept at the hospital had to take the shot or go on unpaid leave. I don't what's up with my brother, they are all in Medicine so who knows what kind of crap they are getting at the hospital or labs.
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"The truth may hurt for a little while, but a lie hurts forever."
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walterharp
69 posts
Sep 25, 2009
10:56 AM
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hope they are all ok, he probably got the regular flu vaccine since the swine flu ones are not supposed to be available till mid october, but that shot does not protect against swine flu or regular flu if they did not predict what strains would be around this winter correctly...
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Buddha
1021 posts
Sep 25, 2009
11:31 AM
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walter- it's swine flu vaccine. Some people have shots already and my dad is a medical professional.
Mid October is when everybody else is supposed to get it.
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"The truth may hurt for a little while, but a lie hurts forever."
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thorvaldsen76
37 posts
Sep 26, 2009
4:26 AM
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I think it's typically for us in the rich world to go all crazy over something like the swine-flu. But I like to see tnings in perspective..
Every 30 seconds a kid dies from malaria. It's something we know how to cure. It's just a question of money,really. But we don't care much because it's something that happens mostly in third-world countries.. And then we go crazy over something that's killed a few thousand worldwide...
Oh,and a woman I worked with said that she didn't fear the swine-flu...because she had slept with a pig for 30 years...lol
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scstrickland
258 posts
Sep 27, 2009
9:04 AM
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Buzadero- I read that and watched some of the vid. I want the five minutes I wasted listening to that crap back.
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mr_so&so
217 posts
Sep 28, 2009
10:55 AM
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Perhaps this pandemic strain is over-hyped, but it could mutate into something nastier. The problem with pandemic strains is that they are different enough that most people don't have any resistance to them. They go everywhere in a hurry, hence the name.
I sat in a walk-in clinic this past weekend for an hour and watched in horror as several kids with active flu-like illness were dragged in, coughing, sneezing, touching everything in site. Even some adults who should know better were showing up sick. They were not turned away, forced to wear masks, or asked wait in another room. There were signs up about what to do, but nobody enforcing anything. All I can say from this that if something nasty does comes along, we are all screwed.
At my work (a university), I wash my hands often and hope for the best. I'll be getting the H1N1 shot too, when that is available. I'd rather build up my immunity that way. There is chance of serious illness either way, but less with the shot.
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RyanMortos
340 posts
Sep 28, 2009
12:31 PM
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May I interject?
AHHHHHHHCH!OOOOOOOOO!
nevermind...
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~Ryan
Pennsylvania - H.A.R.P. (Harmonica Association 'Round Philly)
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GGiles
34 posts
Sep 28, 2009
12:40 PM
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We have news reports up here in Canada they they are going to hold off on the regular flu vaccine due to a study that showed it adversely affect some people who then contracted H1N1.
As mentioned above the current nasal vaccine is a weaked form of the virus (I'd like to avoid that one)
the needle version is dead.
I'll do what I do every year ... wash my hands and cover my mouth with my arm when I cough. I'm healthy and don't like sticking foreign substances in my body alive or dead.
Last Edited by on Sep 28, 2009 12:40 PM
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Harpist
76 posts
Sep 28, 2009
5:06 PM
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Chris,
Just wondering how your father and the rest of your family are doing in their battle to overcome the H1N1 virus. Hopefully much better.
Marc
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