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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
OT question for Dave Payne
OT question for Dave Payne
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Oisin
362 posts
Oct 22, 2009
5:49 PM
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Hey Dave,
this isn't a question about harmonicas but about where you live, which I believe is Virginia. Well I read a story today in paper here in the UK about a snowball fight which happened during the American Civil War in Virginia in the 1860s. Apparently there were eventually 9000 people involved in the snowball fight and it was only stopped when some of the participants started loading the snowballs with stones.
Is this true and do you have any other details of it?. I was fasinated by this story and it reminded me about the stories from WW1 about football matches in no-mans land.
I'd be grateful if you could elaborate on this.
Oisin
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scstrickland
282 posts
Oct 22, 2009
7:00 PM
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Oisin, Dave lives in West Virginia. I, however, live In virginia, Near Williamsburg, Yorktown and Jamestown. Lots of Civil war history here. I had never heard of this snowball fight. But Google led me to this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snowball_fight
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Oisin
363 posts
Oct 22, 2009
9:13 PM
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Hey Scstrickland...thanks a lot for that. It's slightly different from the story I read as it came across as a Yankee vs Confederate snowball fight but the Wiki story seems to say it was the same side throwing them at each other. Even so, it must have been some sight watch 9000 snowballs in the air at one time!!
Maybe Dave knows some more about it.
By the way, are West Virginia and Virginia two different states? Excuse my Irish ignorance..
Oisin
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ElkRiverHarmonicas
314 posts
Oct 23, 2009
6:56 AM
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The Great Snowball Fight of 1863. There were other documented snowball fights, many more probably undocumented, but the one on the Rappahannock was the biggest and coolest. There was something 9,500 soldiers, all Confederates, taking part in it.
It wasn't stopped by officers, the officers took part in it, it ended with a complete asswhipping and domination of the Georgia units, who were unable to continue fighting. The stones had a lot to do with that.
It happened on the Rappahannock River in Virginia, which was the front line in 1863. There was a deep cover of snow on the ground. Conditions were as if Robert E. Lee and God themselves were collaborating to create the perfect snowball conditions: a blizzard followed by sunny sky, relatively warm temps and soft, damp snow and on Lee's part, a reorganization of the army that created these rivalries between units. But there was also this magical White-Christmas-like atmosphere, a lot of these southern soldiers had probably never even seen snow before they enlisted. If you ever watch the news when they get like a tenth of an inch of snow in the deep south, people go crazy, cars sliding all over place, people rushing to stores and buying foodstuffs, that same southern fascination with snow played in. They were also bored as hell.
It started out with these snowball-armed North Carolina soldiers plan of capturing an Georgia unit's camp. It was absolutely hilarious how they did it, it wasn't a mob of guys, they actually formed up just like they would if they were attacking some Yankees. They had a main force of infrantry and deployed skirmishes. They even had a cavalry force in support.
As the North Carolinas attacked with snowballs, the Georgians called up reserves from other nearby units. Reenforcements streamed in for both sides. Even the cooks were called in out of the commissaries to join in. As reenforcements swelled the Georgia side, they beat off the attackers who retreated back to camp.
So at this point, the Georgia officers, just like they would in a real battle, held a Council of War to plan a counterattack.
When the Georgian forces reached they north carolina camp, they found the North Carolinans were well prepared for the counterattack. Instead of making snowballs on the spot, they spent their time filling their haversacks with snowballs. The N.C. soldiers opened up can of Extreme Whoopass on the counterattacking Georgians. They had so many snowballs made up, it was like the Georgians were counterattacking with muzzleloaders, but the N.C. soldiers had AK-47s. Nor were these North Carolina snowballs conventional snowballs. These snowballs were like ice balls, you know where you squeeze the snowball so hard that it becomes this hard chunk of ice. They were also taking rocks and stuff, forming snow around them and throwing those. Guys were getting hurt pretty bad, bloody noses, busted up faces, etc. -- messed up bad. The N.C. soldiers overwhelmed the Georgians pretty quickly and took numerous prisoners. Then they stuffed snow in the prisoner's underwear and stuff. After the battle, the prisoners were paroled.
On West Virginia...
West Virginia, especially the Northern Panhandle, was scheming separation from Virginia as early as the 1820s. We didn't have adequate representation in the Virginia government, didn't care much for slavery and we were pissed off about other stuff, too. But the Constitution prevents carving one state from another without the mother state approval. So we saw the Civil War as a chance ato do it. We wanted independence, the north wanted the B&O railroad, so we hatched up this scheme where after the Virginia succeeded, we reentered the union as Virginia, so Virginia was technically a part of both the Union and Confederacy. To get around that clause in the Constitution, we, (since Va. was no longer in the Union to give its opinion), speaking on behalf of Virginia, gave our consent to create the new state of West Virginia.
It was a ingenious plan, the only anybody ever managed to make one state from another in U.S. History, we're pretty proud of that.
The problem was, they got land hungry and took a lot of Confederate-minded Virginia counties kicking and screaming to make the new state, so many that after the war, the former Confederates dominated state government, moved the capital from Wheeling in the North to Charleston in southern W.Va.
Me, I'm from the Elk River in South Central W.Va.
Dave
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www.elkriverharmonicas.com
Last Edited by on Oct 23, 2009 7:04 AM
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Oisin
364 posts
Oct 23, 2009
3:39 PM
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I think there's a whole new kind of Civil War re-enactment that's just waiting to be resurrected by some enterprising young man here. I'd sure like to take part in a 9500 man snowball fight.
Thanks for the info Dave....I just had a hunch you'd know all about this.
Oisin
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scstrickland
283 posts
Oct 23, 2009
3:56 PM
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Wow! Great story Dave. And history lesson. Don't worry about hard feelings. This Virginian loves West Virginia. New River Gorge is my number one choice of vacation spots. I spent every weekend of this past summer in Wild Wonderful West Virginia. and thanks to you learned to appreciate a West Virginia Hot Dog.
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nacoran
277 posts
Oct 23, 2009
9:26 PM
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You see, that's why the South lost the war. Sure, they had enough snowballs for a single battle, but the North had enough snowballs for the whole war.
I actually have a blond joke about a Civil War re-enactment. I won't make you suffer through the whole thing, but the punch line involves the doctor saying, 'Wait, wasn't the Sharps Big .50 a breech loader?'
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