robin
1 post
Nov 10, 2009
9:43 AM
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First can i start by saying hi to everyone & introduce myself a little (will try not to bore you). Im 26 and live in london, been playing harp for about 6 years. I'm completely harp and music mad, cant get enough (practice everyday). Ever since i was a little kid i was a soul junkie and im talking from about 6/7 years old, which subsequently led to blues and jazz and eventually to the harp (anything funky or with a groove). I love the blues
I have been watching Adams vids ever since he first loaded them and have watched them all a thousand times along with Jason & Chris and thought it about time i speak up. I have learnt so much from all the vids its crazy and im so thankfull to you all especially Adam (along with purchasing a lot of his vids over time). Adam you have given a great gift to people all over the world - music & knowledge. And chris i love your smooth jazzy funky playing - top notch.
Now for my question, well simply a general wondering. When you lot are playing your scales do you include the sharps and flats or not? The reason i ask is because i have a lot of theory books and the blues based ones always give scales without the accidentals, like books on exploring 2nd/3rd position for example and come to think about it online vids. For example the 'Dorian Mode' is given as 4 5+ 5 6+ 6 7 7+ 8. But if you put in the correct sharps (2 of em) it would be 4 5+ 5ob 6+ 6 7 7od 8. Or the 'Aeolian Mode', do you play 3" 3 4+ 4 5+ 5 6+ 6 or do you play 3" 3 4' 4 5+ 5ob 6' 6 with the 3 sharps (F C G). And if your playing with a band and all using the 'Dorian Mode' and your using the first example if at some point you all hit the seventh interval in unison, they would be playing C sharp and you would be playing C - a half step difference.
Any thoughts guys would be great
*the key to eternity is to live a life worth remembering *
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congaron
248 posts
Nov 10, 2009
9:53 AM
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It depends. Sometimes the lead guitarist and i are playing note for note together...other times i am soloing over his second lead or rhythm playing. It all depends on what i am trying to do or imply in the phrase..no set rule for me.
If I am playing the melody, I will play the melody exactly. If I am soloing around the melody, i will wander to and from it as needed.
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Oisin
377 posts
Nov 10, 2009
10:29 AM
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Hi Robin...good to have you aboard. I can't answer any of your questions above as I've never practised a scale in all the time I've played...like quite a few players here I play 100% by ear and not tabs or music.
However if you want to put some of that theory you have into practise you should come along to our jam and let rip. Every wednesday night in Leytonstone there is one of Londons best jams and they are very welcoming to harp players. You'll also get to speak to a few other pros who might be able to answer your question above.
here's a link to the website.
www.coachandhorsesbluesjam.com
If you fancy going one night let me know and I can try and arrange to be there. I work night shifts so can't go every week but with a bit a of notice I can work something out.
Oisin
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mr_so&so
234 posts
Nov 10, 2009
10:38 AM
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Robin, welcome. To address your question, you have got it a bit wrong. The Dorian mode of the major scale has a flattened third and seventh, and as most easily played in 3rd position is 4 5+ 5 6+ 6 7 7+ 8 (the second octave). What you are talking about is the major scale in third position, where you have to play the overbends to get it. I hope this helps.
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Jim Rumbaugh
104 posts
Nov 10, 2009
10:48 AM
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Welcome Robin
Let me throw in what I THINK, may answer your question. When you read about scales that have sharps and flats...... the explanation frequently says you sharp or flat a note RELATIVE to the MAJOR SCALE.
If you are playing in a MODE. You are not playing any sharps or flats. You are playing the "WHITE KEYS" of a piano only. BUT, you are starting the scale in another place other than C. As you play that those notes, some of the intervals will be sharp or flat , relative to a major scale played from the same starting note.
Therefore... (I hope I have this right) MODES doe not have sharps and flats, but scales do.
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robin
2 posts
Nov 10, 2009
10:49 AM
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Oh i understand thank you guys - big help
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MrVerylongusername
625 posts
Nov 10, 2009
10:56 AM
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Hi Robin - welcome aboard.
I'm not really sure I understand your point though. In Dorian mode the 3rd and 7th scale degrees are flat - so D Dorian scale is D E F G A B C D. If you raise the 3rd and 7th, you just get the D major scale D E F# G A B C# D.
This is why 3rd position is great for minor keys, because all the notes of the minor scale (minor 7th) are there without bends or overblows in the middle octave.
***edit*** oops Mr So&So already got there while I was typing this!
Last Edited by on Nov 10, 2009 11:00 AM
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congaron
249 posts
Nov 10, 2009
11:02 AM
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I guess by sharps and flats we're technically talking about accidentals here. Correct, in modes there are no accidentals.
I missed the scale theory part in my answer, but was applying it to perfomance "scale" usage vs. playing licks..sorry about that. My performance preference, BTW, is to play mostly licks and throw in a scale for long runs up or down.
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robin
3 posts
Nov 10, 2009
11:44 AM
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thanks to all your input i think i might of had a mad moment (to be frank i had just had one of my special cigarettes)- i woke up started to play interval patterns and what not and i think i over confused myself with a head full of scales and lost myself a bit but thanks guys i'm back on track.
**harmonica - a band in your hand **
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