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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Harrison Harmonicas, The B-radical and me...
Harrison Harmonicas, The B-radical and me...
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congaron
314 posts
Dec 03, 2009
9:48 AM
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reduced interest in the stock harp will reduce or stabilize the price of the stock harp, or the company will fail. There simply isn't time in the day for a mass producer to customize. Look at suzuki pricing on the harp master, for example. Plenty of quality, plenty cheap. Then look at hohner. It is naive to assume some bad internet press has hurt them as much as some folks would like to believe. I know players who won't play anything else, regardless. I also know people who have no internet and have played for years...hohner only. I say suzuki to them and they look at me like a Harley rider looking at my kawasaki.
I see little chance of a $180 stock harp affecting current stock or custom pricing. Only supply and demand will do that. If people stop buying hohners...the price will drop to increase volume of sales to maintain bottom line profits. If you can't do it on margin, you have to try volume, then you just go out if neither one works. Why do you think there are sales on Black friday? DO you really think custom users will simply stop buying custom harps? If so...prices will drop to regain market share, not raise to match the B- radical.
This isn't the petroleum industry where the law of supply and demand can be reversed at will. Customizers will price as they see fit for their own purposes, regardless of what stock harps do. look at Buddha harp pricing...then shop around some more. There is already something for just about everybody...price-wise.
Last Edited by on Dec 03, 2009 9:52 AM
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MrVerylongusername
674 posts
Dec 03, 2009
9:52 AM
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@Congaron
In the 80s Lee Oskars were big news. Lots of players deserted Hohner in favour of what were then radical new approaches. What was Hohner's response? stopping production of nearly all their handmade models in favour of the horrible MS system (and if you think it's bad now, you should have seen it then). Outsourced production, cheaper materials, emphasis on bulk production rather than the artistry of a handcrafted instrument.
I don't think a $180 harp will affect Hohner pricing, but I do fear it will give them the incentive to revisit the cost cutting of previous years - arguing that the 'discerning player' will only the Crossover or MB Deluxe.
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Bluzdude46
297 posts
Dec 03, 2009
9:54 AM
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Randy, I agree with you on many points. Here is the sticker for me. For just a few bucks more then the $180 price they have started with I can purchase a Custom harp that has been produced using the best of Hohners materials which are the reeds and plates combined with a better material comb worked on individually by a technician who knows exactly how to manipulate these materials for the best sound and playability. I'm also purchasing this product with the knowledge that it's going to last as long as I do not mistreat it and it's going to last me a very, very long time as Harmonica lifespans are. If it fails short of that expectation the person I'm dealing with will work with me to make it right and we will figure out if it's a material thing or the way I'm playing it that made it fail. I have History to fall back on FOR THAT PRICE. I believe that the starting price on this NEW & UNTRIED Product was too high. How was it tested for wear? replacement reeds are great, I don't want to replace one a month. Not at the price for the Harmonica. I'm really not trying to be a prick here but for those who think oh give these guys a chance we all want them to make good, well so do I. I think they could have done better so far and people don't even have the Harp.
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Tuckster
281 posts
Dec 03, 2009
10:20 AM
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@ Bluzdude. You certainly have a point there. Part of the advantage of mass production is to lower costs. I don't quite understand why the B-Radical costs so much if it's mass produced.Will the price go down once they go into full production? If I can buy,say a Buddha custom for that price,how can Brad compete? Only time will tell,I guess.
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ness
123 posts
Dec 03, 2009
10:50 AM
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Tuckster: Ferraris are mass produced.
Randy:
-- declaring their statements are hyperbole implies you have some information to the contrary, right?
-- overly optimistic delivery dates? It's still Fall in this hemisphere. Are they liars if they miss the date anyway? Are NASA people liars every time the shuttle is a little late? Sh*t happens. I gotta feeling they want to get it right more than they want to make you happy.
-- although you state you don't distrust them, you go on to imply they aren't truthful because you haven't seen one, that they've created all this speculation and not delivered, etc.
It's marketing, man. They're trying to create interest in their new product. You should be used to that stuff, we're all surrounded by it.
How about we end the 'vitriolic comments' and just let this thing play out???
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eharp
366 posts
Dec 03, 2009
12:30 PM
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you just gotta love a blues harp forum where the word "subjunctive" gets used, even if it is by somebody that should know the word!! lol
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Randy G. Blues
113 posts
Dec 03, 2009
1:22 PM
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ness:
True that I have no facts nor information to prove that their statements are hyperbole. Actually, neither do they.
Delivery date: I never said they were liars. Things happen in production of such a product- or any product. My statements in regards to delivery were meant to show that they would have been better off to wait before stating any date.
I do not trust nor distrust them at this point. What if we met at a jam and I said to you, "I have a new method that can make any harp player perform at a professional's level. Within the first hour you will learn to overblow and bend notes with dead-on precision. Your speed will be that of any other professional wind instruments' player. It makes all other methods instantly obsolete," ?
You would say, "Shut the F up and prove it," and you would be fully justified in saying so. Basically, that's what I am saying about the B-radical. Enough with the hype. Deliver it. Prove it.
You say, "It's marketing, man." I couldn't agree more. But it is empty promises until we actually see production begin, harps in the hands of players, and independent reviews.
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ness
124 posts
Dec 03, 2009
2:33 PM
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Actually, I *wouldn't* say STFU and prove it. I'd THINK to myself you're full of sh*t, and that'd be that. It would be enough. We're probably different in that way.
You say empty promises -- I say they're just promises. Are all promises empty until fulfilled? Faith's out of the question then, right?
It's OK to be skeptical, and you've made some small concessions that 'things happen'and they're not liars, but the recurring themes in your posts are that they're spewing BS, they've got nothing to show us, they should never have put a date on it, and they're behind schedule. And you just don't have the facts to back it up.
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KeithE
72 posts
Dec 03, 2009
3:35 PM
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I wish them the best of luck. I've never purchased a custom, but it would be nice to have something available off the shelf that was say half as good as a custom.
One reason I like the idea of a company doing this is the fear of the individual customizers burning out, doing more playing and less customizing, or otherwise getting backlogged. For a production harp you should be able to get one in days, and there should be some redundancy in their organization. (They should pass the "bus test.") Hopefully they will be profitable and able to pay their employees a decent wage.
If you could buy replacement reeds at a reasonably low price you might feel more comfortable doing your own reedwork, and experimenting more.
Even if this effort completely fails, they may have made some technical advancements in the production of reeds that could wind up in other production harps.
I haven't placed a preorder and will wait until the reviews come in.
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