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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Carey Bell and the All-Time Harp Greats List
Carey Bell and the All-Time Harp Greats List
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atty1chgo
674 posts
Aug 06, 2013
6:56 AM
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I guess we will always have debate on whether there should be 11 members of a Top Ten list, and who belongs. But I know one thing. Before the Rod Piazzas and Rick Estrins and John Poppers and all others in the Honorable Mention List (all great players, no doubt) have a chance to get into the Second Top Ten List, they have to get past Carey Bell, and I don't see that EVER happening.
--- Influenced by DeFord Bailey, Little Walter, Big Walter, and Sonny Boy Williamson I and II
--- Taught to play the harp by Little Walter and Big Walter Horton.
--- His work with Earl Hooker, Robert Nighthawk, Lowell Fulson, Eddie Taylor, Louisiana Red, Big Walter Horton, Jimmy Dawkins, James Cotton, Junior Wells etc.
--- Member of both Muddy Waters and Willie Dixon's bands, and his recordings with his own bands, and with his son, Lurrie Bell.
--- Mentored and heavily influenced blues harp great Billy Branch and many others.
-- A great chromatic harp player as well.
Carey Bell is one of the greatest harp players in the history of the blues, and is not mentioned often enough when talking about the harp giants.
Last Edited by atty1chgo on Aug 06, 2013 6:56 AM
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atty1chgo
675 posts
Aug 06, 2013
7:00 AM
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The lighter background harp is played by his son, Steve Bell, in this recording.
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atty1chgo
676 posts
Aug 06, 2013
7:01 AM
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Heartaches and Pain - Chromatic C harp.
Last Edited by atty1chgo on Aug 06, 2013 7:02 AM
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harpdude61
1773 posts
Aug 06, 2013
8:03 AM
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The list was once very interesting to me. The debates were great. Inclusion (and exclusion)meant something. The guidelines for ranking were well thought out. I always got excited and interested when a move was about to be made. I even studied the writers reasoning.
The list lost everything to me when it was made top 11 or whatever and became a chicken poo joke.
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Kingley
2983 posts
Aug 06, 2013
8:24 AM
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Carey Bell was a great harp player. Seriously bad ass. One of my all time favourite players. He often played deceptively simple sounding lines, that in reality were filled with technical complexity.
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blueswannabe
244 posts
Aug 06, 2013
2:29 PM
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Carey Bell is awesome! A Great harp player and bluesman. There are some excellent youtube videos with him and his son Lurrie Bell. He's got a great deep blues voice and is very soulful. See, e.g., Heartaches and Pains. One of my favorites.
Last Edited by blueswannabe on Aug 07, 2013 4:39 AM
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capnj
145 posts
Aug 06, 2013
8:27 PM
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All alone late at night,possibly having a drink in hand,thinking about losing your wife,girlfriend,or just letting the blues permeate your soul,put carey on.His words are true,the harp tone is clear as a bell,a touch of the masters hand,his phrasing hard to copy,but I never tire of him,hear somethings on the chromatic nobody does better,even though they sound simple.
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blueswannabe
245 posts
Aug 07, 2013
4:48 AM
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Listen to the subtleties of his chromatic work.
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Shredder
385 posts
Aug 07, 2013
12:15 PM
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Can any one identify what model of harp"super64?" and the key ?, Carey is playing in the "Short dress woman" video?
Looks like it's had a ruff life with the duct tape on it.
Mike
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kudzurunner
4189 posts
Aug 07, 2013
9:15 PM
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@harpdude: Your comment is hysterically funny. When my first serious girlfriend (live-in for five years) decided to move out, I kept saying "But you said you loved me!" As if rationality could keep the blues at bay. As if I could somehow prove to her that she was REQUIRED to stay because of things she'd said in the past.
You're complaining because, on this blues harmonica website, I've irrationally made the top-10 list a top-11 list. My irrationality bothers you. In fact, it's given you something like the blues. You're pissed off.
Hey, you're welcome! I've done my job.
My job is NOT to make nice, or to be always supremely rational. My job, as a steward of the blues and of blues harmonica, is sometimes to break the mold. That's how you know you're dealing with blues and not some stylized pretend-blues. I've done you a service that you don't quite appreciate.
Anybody who comes to a website like this expecting all the pieces to fit has missed the point. The pieces don't fit. They've never fit. If you find a blues harmonica website, or player, where they DO all fit, then the blues--the real blues--is missing. It's just pretend blues. Wikipedia style blues. School of Rock blues. That's not blues.
The blues is the big wild scary sad feeling that you were supposed to be immune to. Then you're on your honeymoon in Venice Beach and some idiot decides to drive onto the boardwalk and mow people down and he mows down your new wife. And the blues pours down on you.
Or you've been dating somebody for a couple of months, she's promising, she's what you've been looking for, and then suddenly she's not interested. And you've got the blues in a big way. Getting through the next 24 or 48 hours is going to hurt. You suspect that the hurt is going to linger for a long time.
Any member of this forum who doesn't understand what I'm talking about, instantly and intuitively, doesn't know what the blues are about. They're about the things that aren't supposed to happen, the changes life isn't supposed to put you through, the disgust and anxiety and fear and pissed-off-ness that make you need the music.
A top-10 list that happens to contain 11 players: THAT has depressed and disillusioned you? Well, I've done my job--I've bluesed you up--but I think you've set your bluesification threshold too low. It's just not that big a deal. It's like somebody saying they're going to serve lunch at noon and making you wait until 12:30. I realize that such things dismay and even anger some people, but I'm not sure they deserve such intense emotional investments.
Last Edited by kudzurunner on Aug 07, 2013 9:27 PM
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harpdude61
1774 posts
Aug 08, 2013
9:06 AM
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Trust me kudzu....I know what having the blues is all about. More than you can imagine.
Hey, I'm the guy that came to your first HCH two days after being released from the hospital with bleeding ulcers, sleeping in my little non-AC Honda just to learn, grow, and absorb. My passion and hunger were at an all time peak! That is nothing compared to REALLY having the blues.
Your response does not correlate with my post. Sounds like you are coming up with a way to justify your going to Top 11 while making me look like I know nothing about the blues.
"depressed and disillusioned"...I hardly think so. If your goal by doing this was to make your members go into "disgust and anxiety and fear and pissed-off-ness" ...I doubt you succeeded. Didn't with me anyway. Make it Top 13 or 14 and we'll watch the blues filled tears roll down the street.
Dude..it's like a tie game..kissing your sister. It loses something.
You obviously took your Top 10 lists very seriously at one time. I can tell you put much time and thought into your criteria as well as your original list. I also remember your lengthy thought filled posts when you would move someone up. When you felt someone was ready to move up, it meant you had to bring somebody down. Not move them laterally. Maybe this caused you to have a " big wild scary sad feeling" which induced some blues that was more than you could handle?
I didn't change my life at all. It just made something that was once very interesting,intriguing, and thought provoking, less so.
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groyster1
2328 posts
Aug 08, 2013
9:28 AM
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I just noticed 11 in the top ten recently but understand now why you did it....it bothers me not...I personally appreciate all the great harp players...they all inspire me to the nth degree
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atty1chgo
679 posts
Aug 08, 2013
10:57 AM
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By all means, don't hold back. :)
It's not an exact science. Most of us have listened enough to know who belongs on what list. It's really not that important in the grand scheme of things,
The players who are considered the greatest will be listened to by blues harp fans long after they are gone, because their body of work will speak for itself.
Last Edited by atty1chgo on Aug 08, 2013 11:05 AM
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harpdude61
1775 posts
Aug 08, 2013
11:31 AM
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It shouldn't bother you groyster and I appreciate all the players as well Something to be learned form all including the honorable mentions.
EXACTLY..atty..it's not an exact science..not like the golf money list..more like the BCS rankings...debate stirring.
Now if Adam's list was ranked 1-20 in his exact order then my point would not matter, but he posted Top 10 and Second 10 with no order within the 10.
I'm sure if he posted his Top 20 in specific order based on his criteria, it would be interesting and lead to much fun debate!
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Honkin On Bobo
1139 posts
Aug 08, 2013
4:42 PM
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Ten, eleven....whatever.
Just don't disrespect School Of Rock.
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blueswannabe
247 posts
Aug 08, 2013
5:49 PM
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When I first saw this youtube video, I didn't know that he had passed. I was very disappointed that I didn't have a chance to see him perform.
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Tweedaddict
90 posts
Aug 08, 2013
6:04 PM
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Gawd there's some way too tight underwear around here!
DAMN...
Carey had one helluva loooooooong list of good work.
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fred_gomez
141 posts
Aug 08, 2013
9:23 PM
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i think its a 280/64. i have seen pic of him holding a 280 with the button broken off with no attempt of a repair job. i dont think he did much button work. the duct tape here doesnt seem to be because of lost bolts. since its both ends it may be to save air or funnel out sound to the mic. or maybe to tape off holes he doesnt use. he usually played the chrome in D 3rd.
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JInx
491 posts
Aug 09, 2013
12:37 AM
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"Hey, you're welcome! I've done my job. "
That kind of talk, is just hard to listen to. Right?
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Sun, sun, sun
Burn, burn, burn
Soon, soon, soon
Moon, moon, moon
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Frank
2608 posts
Aug 09, 2013
3:40 AM
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This CD will is his Masterpiece :)
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Shredder
386 posts
Aug 09, 2013
12:08 PM
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Thanks Fred for the answer.
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groyster1
2329 posts
Aug 09, 2013
12:19 PM
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back to debate....cannot in my wildest dreams, imagine carey bell not being on any top 10 list...love my harp attack cd and careys on it....
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timeistight
1321 posts
Aug 09, 2013
1:26 PM
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I think everyone would agree that John Lee Williamson, Rice Miller, Walter Jacobs and Walter Horton belong on an "all-time greats" list, but after that, things get arbitrary.
Why Sonny Terry and not Deford Bailey? Why James Cotton and not Carey Bell? Why Paul Butterfield and not Charlie Musselwhite? Why Sugar Blue and not Magic Dick? Why Jason Ricci and not Carlos Del Junco?
Because those are the players who are important to Adam Gussow and it's his list.
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1847
964 posts
Aug 09, 2013
1:30 PM
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reminds me of the song by jackson browne
red neck friend.
he sings ..the missing link the kitchen sink
eleven on a scale of ten!
carey is an eleven on a scale of 1 to 10
that's even better than #1
carey bell... eleven on a "Richter scale"
i am making myself laugh ha ha ha
the summer of 2003 video that was posted
is very powerful.
lurrie bell was sitting next too me a few weeks ago
i didn't want to bother him, i could have just sat down at his table and had a talk with him.
maybe next time.
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master po
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fred_gomez
142 posts
Aug 09, 2013
5:34 PM
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i'm always wrong
Carey Bell (November 14th, 1936 - )
Lefty Dizz – Ain’t It Nice To Be Loved (JSP Records, 1995)
1. Cloudy Weather – A, No Harp
2. That's Alright In The Dark – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
3. I Feel Like Jumping – E, No Harp
4. Bad Avenue – G, No Harp
5. Ain't It Nice To Be Loved – G, No Harp
6. Look On Yonders Wall – D, C Chromatic (3rd Position)
7. Too Late – G, C Harp (2nd Position)
8. Sadie – E, No Harp
9. Where The Hell Where You When I got Home? – E, No Harp
*Carey Bell on Harmonica
Big Walter Horton With Carey Bell (Alligator, 1989)
1. Have A Good Time – G, C Harp (2nd Position)
2. Christine - G, C Harp (2nd Position)
3. Lovin' My Baby (w/ Bell) – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
4. Little Boy Blue (w/ Bell) – F, Bb Harp (2nd Position)
5. Can't Hold Out Much Longer - E, A Harp (2nd Position)
6. Under The Sun - G, low C Harp (2nd Position)
7. Tell Me Baby - E, A Harp (2nd Position)
8. Have Mercy (w/ Bell) – D, Chromatic
9. That Ain't It - E, A Harp (2nd Position)
10. Temptation (w/ Bell) - E, A Harp (2nd Position)
11. Trouble In Mind – A, A Harp (1st Position)
Carey Bell’s Blues Harp (Delmark, 1995)
1. I'm Ready – Bb, Eb Harp (2nd Position)
2. I Got To Find Somebody – A, A Harp (1st)
3. I Wanna Will My Love To You – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
4. Blue Monday At Kansas City Red's [Inst.] – Eb, C Chromatic w/ lever depressed (3rd Position)
5. I'm Gonna Buy Me A Train Ticket – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
6. Come On Over Here - Eb, C Chromatic w/ lever depressed (3rd Position)
7. I Cry So Much – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
8. Sad Dreams [Inst.] - Eb, C Chromatic w/ lever depressed (3rd Position)
9. Everything's Up Tight – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
10. You Know It Ain't Right - Bb, Eb Harp (2nd Position)
11. Last Night – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
12. Rocking With A Chromatic [Inst.] - Eb, C Chromatic w/ lever depressed (3rd Position)
13. I'm Gonna Buy Me A Train Ticket (alt.) – A, Harp (2nd Position)
14. Walking In The Park – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
15. Carey Bell's Blues Harp [Inst.] – A,
Verse 1 – 2: A Harp (1st Position)
Verse 3 - 4: D Harp (2nd Position)
Verse 5: A Harp (1st Position)
Verse 6 – 9: G Harp (3rd Position)
Verse 10 - 11: D Harp (2nd Position)
Deep Down (Alligator 1995)
1. I Got to Go – B, A Harp (3rd Position)
2. Let Me Stir in Your Pot – G, C Harp (2nd Position)
3. When I Get Drunk – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
4. Low Down Dirty Shame – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
5. Borrow Your Love – E, A harp (2nd Position)
6. Lonesome Stranger – Am, D Harp (2nd Position)
7. After You – A, Intro & Outro A Harp (1st Position), Solo A Harp (1st Position) & D Harp (2nd Position)
8. I Got a Rich Man's Woman – G, C Harp (2nd Position)
9. Jawbreaker – D, C Chromatic in 3rd
10. Must I Holler – Dm, C Chromatic in 3rd
11. Tired of Giving You My Love – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
12. Easy – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
Dynasty (JSP, 1996)
1. Brought Up The Hard Way – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
2. What My Mama Told Me, (I Shoulda Did) – G, C Harp (2nd Position)
3. The Gladys Shuffle [Inst.] – Eb, C Chromatic w/ lever depressed (3rd
Position)
4. I'll Be Your 44 – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
5. New Harp In Town [Inst.] – G, C Harp (2nd Position)
6. I Need You So Bad – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
7. I Don't Need No Woman – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
8. As The Years Go Passing By - D, G Harp (2nd Position)
9. Sail On – A, D Harp (2nd Position)
Good Luck Man (Alligator, 1997)
1. My Love Strikes Like Lightning – F, Bb Harp (2nd Position)
2. Love Her, Don't Shove Her – A, Intro, Outro & 1st Solo: Low D Harp (2nd Position), 2nd Solo: G Harp (3rd Position)
3. Sleeping With The Devil – A, Intro & Solo: Low D Harp (2nd Position), Outro: G Harp (3rd Position)
4. Harding Working Woman – D, Chromatic
5. Bell Hop [Inst.] – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
6. Bad Habits – F, Bb Harp (2nd Position)
7. Good Luck Man – E, A Harp (2nd Position)
8. Hard Hearted Woman – A, A Harp (1st Position)
9. Going Back to Mississippi – D, Intro & 1st part of solo: C Chrom
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groyster1
2330 posts
Aug 09, 2013
6:07 PM
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yo fred
I think carey had it well covered.....top 10...no doubt
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blueswannabe
249 posts
Aug 09, 2013
6:51 PM
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Fred thanks for list. Does anyone know if Lurriie played any gigs with Carey after the summer of 2003 video?
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tmf714
1873 posts
Aug 10, 2013
6:09 AM
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Live at Rosa's 2006-
Last Edited by tmf714 on Aug 10, 2013 6:11 AM
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tmf714
1874 posts
Aug 10, 2013
6:13 AM
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tmf714
1875 posts
Aug 10, 2013
6:23 AM
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I went to see Carey at Mannys Car Wash in NYC-Mason was there-not sure if Adam was there that night.
Mason left early-said Carey was playing too much chromatic for his liking-that performance led me to learning how to play the "big" harp-
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blueswannabe
250 posts
Aug 10, 2013
7:21 AM
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@tmf714, thanks for The Live at Roas's video. Nice to see them playing together. There is a good split shot of them beginning at 1:54.
Is Carey playing a diatonic? What key? Because he plays it like a chro.?
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tmf714
1876 posts
Aug 10, 2013
8:44 AM
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The tune "Gettin' Up" is in the key of B-Carey is using an A harp in third position-he was so damn good at that!
Last Edited by tmf714 on Aug 10, 2013 8:44 AM
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groyster1
2332 posts
Aug 10, 2013
12:51 PM
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OT:could not help but noticing the ticket"all the bud draft you can drink for$6"....bet that brought the street drunks in....
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tmf714
1877 posts
Aug 10, 2013
1:06 PM
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"OT:could not help but noticing the ticket"all the bud draft you can drink for$6"....bet that brought the street drunks in.... "
Not so much in that area of NYC-in the Bowery,Village or Lower East Side,then maybe.
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blueswannabe
251 posts
Aug 11, 2013
7:22 AM
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@tmf714, thanks. He plays a lot of double stops and octaves. 3rd position tends to be mostly draw notes, right?
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tmf714
1878 posts
Aug 11, 2013
8:07 AM
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Third position in the blues or "Dorian" mode,yes-mostly draw,but there are some blow notes used as well.
But it is Carey's use of the octaves here that really grabs the ear as sounding chromatic like.
Last Edited by tmf714 on Aug 11, 2013 8:08 AM
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The Iceman
1082 posts
Aug 11, 2013
10:33 AM
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@Kudzu and Harpdude
Regarding the Top 10 List that went to 11.
This sez it all....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ll7rWiY5obI&list=PL983C05B532F30D38
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The Iceman
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harpdude61
1779 posts
Aug 11, 2013
8:26 PM
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lol....good one Iceman.
I would still love to see Adam take his criteria and rank em 1- 20 or even 1-21 in exact order. With his knowledge and experience I think it would be fun and interesting.
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kudzurunner
4191 posts
Aug 12, 2013
5:57 AM
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timeistight writes:
"Why Sonny Terry and not Deford Bailey? Why James Cotton and not Carey Bell? Why Paul Butterfield and not Charlie Musselwhite? Why Sugar Blue and not Magic Dick? Why Jason Ricci and not Carlos Del Junco?
Because those are the players who are important to Adam Gussow and it's his list."
By this point, I think everybody realizes that you know how to carry a grudge. You were a friendly guy until I dared, several years ago, to criticize a Canadian guitarist named David Gogo. Since that moment, you've missed no occasion to perform your grudge. Congratulations! You've got the blues. But I'm really not worth your continued investment of grudge.
However: since you've asked the question, even if only rhetorically, I'll answer.
Why Sonny Terry and not Deford Bailey: 1) Terry has been hugely influential on several generations of acoustic blues players in a way that clearly exceeds Bailey's influence; 2) evident as Bailey's technical gifts are, they are indisputably exceeded by Terry, who blows him away at all points in his career, especially in the matter of interplay between vocals, hoots, and playing. (Bailey sounds stiffly on-the-beat when placed next to Terry's wild notes--on Terry's "Spirituals to Swing" performance (found on SONNY TERRY AND HIS MOUTH HARP, a must have album: http://www.amazon.com/music/dp/B006G4WWGY); 3) Terry's recorded output--one reason for his influence--hugely exceeds Baileys. Mere quantity of output obviously means nothing in itself; but quantity interfused with quality is how I define "epic," and Terry's output is indeed epic.
Why Cotton and not Carey Bell? I love them both and have seen both many times. Both were, of course, holders of the harp chair in Muddy's Band. 1) Cotton's sound has been, I believe, significantly more influential on other players, so that it is possible to "hear" Cotton in other players in a way that it's much more difficult (and less common) to "hear" Bell in other players. On the criterion "central to the tradition," I think Cotton is a stronger candidate than Bell, in part because his own debt to Rice Miller is both audible and fully subsumed. In a world dominated by Little Walter and SBW, he found his way to a strong, immediately identifiable style of his own; 2) Although I love Bell's "Big Walter Strut," I still think that Cotton's "Creeper Creeps Again" is as strong, technically prodigious, and perfect a blues harmonica recording as anything in the tradition. In sum: two great players, but I believe that Cotton is more central to the tradition
Why Butterfield and not Musselwhite? This should be obvious: because Butterfield's single-note approach has been a huge stylistic influence in a way that Musselwhite's playing simply hasn't. Musselwhite's range is somewhat larger, but perhaps because he's gone in so many directions, he hasn't left a stylistic imprint on the tradition in anything like the way that Butterfield has. I am always coming across strong modern players, including Paul Harrington, Rob Paparozzi, and Felix Cabrera, who have an audible debt to Butterfield. I have a hard time naming a single player who has an audible debt to Musselwhite. On the flip side, of course, Musselwhite was until fairly recently one of the few players who really mined the upper octave of the harp, especially in the way he uses high-register octaves. Musselwhite is a strong, important, even indispensable player, but he didn't shift the game. Butterfield did.
As for Sugar Blue / Magic Dick and Jason Ricci / Carlos del Junco: harder questions, those! Sugar Blue gets where he is for three reasons that I've specified elsewhere: 1) stylistically, he has as powerfully and immediately identifiable a style as ANY player who has come along in the past thirty years. He exceeds the three-second radio test: I daresay that any one of us could identify his sound in two seconds; 2) that sound is grounded in speed-wizardy and (importantly) an original melodic concept derived from bebop....
to be continued.......
Last Edited by kudzurunner on Aug 12, 2013 6:03 AM
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kudzurunner
4192 posts
Aug 12, 2013
6:02 AM
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....that sets him apart from all but a handful of brilliant players. Technically, by 1980, he was in a class by himself. Jason Ricci's approach isn't comprehensible without Sugar Blue already there, in place, doing his thing. 3) Sugar Blue, more than any contemporary harp player I can think of, has redefined and modernized the sound of the contemporary blues ensemble by adding rock and funk played by the strongest crop of next-generation Chicago players. He's been doing this since I first saw him in the late 1980s. He's taken the classics of Chicago blues, including "One More Mile," "Hoochie Coochie Man," and "Messin With the Kid," and shown us what post-Walter, post-Cotton Chicago blues can be. Like his sound or not, he's absolutely central to the evolving tradition. He's arguably THE modern blues harmonica player of our time, for the three reasons that I've listed.
Jason is arguably the same thing; his energy and creativity is just as outsized as Blue's and his technical and improvisational gifts, helped by the addition of overblows, at least meet and arguably exceed Blue's. He has also already had an audible influence on a new generation of younger blues players, most of whom get discussed regularly here and/or participate in these discussions.
As for Jason compared with Carlos: I'm planning to bring both of them to HCH 2014 so we can answer your question. They have never met, much less shared a stage.
I think that Norton Buffalo almost certainly deserves to be somewhere in the two lists, BTW.
EDITED TO ADD: Here's a free bit of Terry's "Fox Chase" from the late 1930's performance. Bailey, great as he is, can't touch this:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AFAFXB6/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1/176-8401907-8181202?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_r=1RC0SSDN199GHKAD42V8&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_p=1535523722&pf_rd_i=B006G4WWGY
Last Edited by kudzurunner on Aug 12, 2013 6:16 AM
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harpdude61
1780 posts
Aug 12, 2013
6:25 AM
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Thank you Adam..I needed that. You are so good at expressing your opinion as to whay 1 is better than 2 or 10 better than 11 or 20 better than 21.
True it is YOUR list. That said, if it were my list, I would be flattered that up and coming players valued my opinion. Flattered that my opinion made players research and give another listen and order a harp CD. Flattered that I was in a position of an ambassador for the instrument and it professionals past and present.
Top 10...2nd 10...honorable mention...your word matters.
Jason and Carlos?? Are you serious? I just peed my pants.
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The Iceman
1084 posts
Aug 12, 2013
6:47 AM
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Everyone has an opinion.
Here's mine re:Jason and Carlos...
Over the years, I've heard a lot of Carlos' ideas used in Jason's solos, but have never once heard Carlos use Jason's.
Personally, this alone puts Carlos up a bit above Jason in my estimation.
Keep in mind that I think both of them are world class players.
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The Iceman
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Miles Dewar
1488 posts
Aug 12, 2013
6:24 PM
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@harpdude,
At least he attempted to justify the choices. Have you done so with your ideal list? If not, why are you wasting your time complaining instead of supplying *your* evidence for whichever list arrangement suits you?
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harpdude61
1781 posts
Aug 12, 2013
7:12 PM
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Miles...first of all..no one is gonna give a crap about my list. Sure I could share my opinion, but it would be based on a much smaller blues/harmonica world than Adam has been exposed to. I always learned from his comparisons. Learned what to watch for and listen for whether I agreed or not.
I will justify one choice. Ricci could very well go down as the greatest blues harp player of all time...my evidence. I've heard him play.
I respect your opinion Ice, but I hear as much originality from Jason as I ever have from anyone. What puts Jason ahead for me is the soulfulness when he plays the blues. I get chill bumps just thinking about it!
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Frank
2617 posts
Aug 13, 2013
9:52 AM
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Ice, I think that's called selective hearing :)
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The Iceman
1090 posts
Aug 13, 2013
10:21 AM
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Hey Frank...call it what you will.
I also know who Carlos' early influences were, as he played some of their ideas while developing his own voice.
It's been hard for me to come to the realization that what and how I hear music isn't the way most people do...my whole life I've been audio driven and am not very visual.
Over the years my hearing comprehension has accelerated to the point where I can hear and recognize individual notes flying by at high velocity. I also seem to be developing a sense of perfect pitch.
Some of this is attributed to David L. Burge's courses and to the college music theory degree I received a long time ago.
So, I do hear when musicians quote or use other's ideas...mostly becomes apparent when I hear the beginning of a musical line and can predict the complete outcome...here is where I know they have memorized someone else's idea and are replaying it.
Makes it a bit hard for me to get excited about many musicians, harmonica and otherwise, unless they play at a certain level.
My love of Miles Davis stems from this, as he worked his whole life to slowly eliminate unnecessary notes and discover the core of ideas.
For harmonica players, I always recommend listening to his recording "ASCENSEUR POUR L'ECHEFAUD (ELEVATOR TO THE GALLOWS) - MUSIC FROM THE MOTION PICTURE".
The whole soundtrack was cut in an afternoon in which Miles entered a French recording studio and had the session players play a minor blues. He simply improvised over it....very easily accessible to third position playing....but those ideas...wow. Opened up my imagination.
Anyways, accelerated hearing and perfect pitch are a curse as well as a blessing, as it makes it harder to just simply sit back and enjoy, as everything I hear gets filtered through my blessing/curse.
Everyone likes what they like. It even seems to change based on maturity and age.
Glad there's so much music out there from which to choose.
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The Iceman
Last Edited by The Iceman on Aug 13, 2013 10:22 AM
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tmf714
1879 posts
Aug 13, 2013
10:52 AM
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"For harmonica players, I always recommend listening to his recording "ASCENSEUR POUR L'ECHEFAUD (ELEVATOR TO THE GALLOWS) - MUSIC FROM THE MOTION PICTURE".
I have to strongly disagree-that was some of Miles WORST playing.
If your going to attempt to play harp to Miles ,you would be better off playing to "Kind Of Blue"-"So What" or "All Blues" is great to play along to -"A Night in Tunisia" is great as well-
And Tim Gonzalez -MONSTER jazz harp-
Last Edited by tmf714 on Aug 13, 2013 11:00 AM
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tmf714
1880 posts
Aug 13, 2013
11:06 AM
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Here is Miles recording "Gallows"-
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The Iceman
1092 posts
Aug 13, 2013
11:15 AM
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It's OK to disagree.
His playing on Gallows is bluesy, haunting, simple, easily accessible, and notice how he bends notes similar to what we might do on diatonic.
He will land on the 4th degree and sustain it, which alone creates tension.
When he eventually rips a quicker line, it is ripe with excellent choices.
Nothing wrong with letting one long note and its tone set the mood.
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The Iceman
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1847
971 posts
Aug 13, 2013
11:27 AM
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so iceman, just curious. can you still appreciate
artist like carey bell? to me some of the best music is simple.
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master po
i get a lot of request when i play
"but i play anyway"
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