kudzurunner
929 posts
Jan 09, 2010
3:34 AM
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Dutch Bones has officially resigned. Thanks for your service, DB. We all appreciate it.
I have, without their permission, deputized Buzadero and GermanHarpist. They strike me as level-headed and well-intentioned: true friends of the forum. If you gentlemen are willing to serve as moderators, great! If not, that's fine, too. Just email me (asgussow@aol.com) and I'll de-deputize you.
Truth be told, I've been doing other things for the past several days and missed the whole "respect" thread. So I'll just say the following:
Chopper, if you're able to provoke this entire forum to unite in outrage--bunch of contrary, seething souls that it is--then you're out of line, plain and simple. Please cease and desit. Your New Year and ours deserves better. I wish you well in your future endeavors.
Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 3:36 AM
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saregapadanisa
45 posts
Jan 09, 2010
5:25 AM
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Thanks, Adam.
And thanks to the moderators who help keeping this communty alive and vibrant.
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scrybe314
39 posts
Jan 09, 2010
6:39 AM
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I'll second that emotion. Despite the flames and the bad blood and the blues nastiness we get here from time to time, y'all do this forum a world of good. Cheers to ya, mates.
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Hobostubs Ashlock
270 posts
Jan 09, 2010
6:43 AM
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whats a moderater and what do they do ?
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LeonStagg
88 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:13 AM
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O.T.
Hobostubs, hope everything is o.k. Take care bro.
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Hobostubs Ashlock
272 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:16 AM
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thanks yea it looks like the tests came back allright ill know for sure in 2 weeks when i go back to the VA.All i wanted to do in the hospital was play my harp i left it and Adams book that i was reading at home i was in such a hurry.But im feelin better now
Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 7:17 AM
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tookatooka
972 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:33 AM
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A Moderator is someone who volunteers to keep the forum running smoothly by detecting and deleting spam posts, and generally ensure that forum members abide by the rules of conduct to provide a pleasant atmosphere to discuss harp related things.
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Hobostubs Ashlock
273 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:40 AM
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thanks i thought that was what one was but wasnt sure i havent been in many forums.So they can delete a post that needs to be removed im guessing
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tookatooka
974 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:55 AM
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That's it in a nutshell Hobo.
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Hobostubs Ashlock
274 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:58 AM
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that sounds like it could be tricky trying to firgure out when to pull the plug or not so to speak
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Greg Heumann
216 posts
Jan 09, 2010
9:14 AM
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It is a thankless job. There are some cases in which you can't win. I have been a moderator in the past of some fairly popular boards in a different hobby. It can be amazing just how clueless some people can be about their own style of communication and its incendiary effect.
My hat is off to Adam and the moderators of this board for the work they do - most of us will never know. Thank you.
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/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
BlueState - my band
Bluestate on iTunes
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jonsparrow
1631 posts
Jan 09, 2010
9:22 AM
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3 cheers for the new mods. hip hip hooray, hip hip hooray, hip hip hooray. may there reign last a 1000 glorious years.
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GermanHarpist
903 posts
Jan 09, 2010
9:24 AM
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Wait a minute jon... ;)
Adam, I'm honored to be appointed one of the moderators and I'm very much inclined just to say 'yes'. However, I have my concerns.
While tooka did a good job of defining the responsibilites of a moderator 'in a nut shell' I believe that this is not enough as guidelines.
It would be good for the moderators to have some clear rules on which to act otherwise it will too often come down to 'judgement calls'. As we have seen this easily creates a situation in which some forum members feel treated unfairly. And this again puts the moderators in awkward positions.
I think that the community is quite able of deciding what rules they want to be moderated by. This would create a more transparent situation for the forum members and a solid foundation on which the moderators can act.
Now to who should actually be moderators.
I feel bad questioning your decision and I'm sure that Buzadero and I would have done our best to meet our responsibilities. However, I believe this decision again should be up to the community.
So if you are ok with that I would very much like to open a new MODERATORS thread. The aim of the thread would be to define some clear cut rules for the moderators on which a majority of the community agree. Once this is done I would suggest that the forum elects the moderators themselves.
I think that's very much in the spirit of the community.
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 10:07 AM
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jonsparrow
1632 posts
Jan 09, 2010
9:27 AM
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just follow your heart....but not your german heart. ;)
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GermanHarpist
904 posts
Jan 09, 2010
9:36 AM
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A german with heart... interesting idea...
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
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addict
34 posts
Jan 09, 2010
10:00 AM
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Well, you could do something simple. Like put a time limit or post limit on something that is inflammatory. I hated that every time I came to the forum there were MORE posts to the Respect and Ink threads. Like that is the MOST important thing we have to talk about. Why fan those flames anyway?
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GermanHarpist
907 posts
Jan 09, 2010
10:11 AM
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Unfortunately there's no such thing as a post or time limit. I'm not quite sure what the powers of a moderators actually are.
I know that they can delete posts. However, can they lock threads (or can only Adam do that)? Can they edit other peoples posts?
Would be interesting to know.
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 10:12 AM
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addict
35 posts
Jan 09, 2010
10:21 AM
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Well I wasn't expecting automatic expiration. I meant that the rule would be delete or lock it after so many posts or so much time. Then it would be easy for the moderator to know what to do.
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nacoran
748 posts
Jan 09, 2010
11:51 AM
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GH- On the other moderators thread I gave my two cents, since you are asking for feedback.
Warnings first. There are two kinds of warnings: the gentle, lets keep it civil warning and the keep it civil or I'm locking the thread types.
Lock threads second.
Delete only if hate start spilling out into other threads. Although sometimes a 'lets fix this' thread might be OK, it's just when an argument in a speaker thread starts spilling out into other on-topic threads that it's really a problem. Sometimes controversial threads actually spin off useful threads. My 'Music that Makes You Crazy' and MVLUV's 'Rap' thread I think were both inspired by contentious threads, and they were both pretty fun, productive threads.
Ban only if one person keeps doing it over and over.
There should be some way, off thread, to let the mods know there is a problem, so someone who doesn't feel comfortable speaking up can bring something up.
Deleting is where you get hard feelings, because no matter how hard headed people have been they think they are right, and if you delete their post they think you've deleted part of the proof that they were right. It might not be a bad idea, if you are locking a thread, to make a final boilerplate comment explaining why, without getting personal, the thread is frozen, so people who stumble on it in the archives have some idea. (blatant racism, sexism, attacks on members, inappropriate for forum (although I prefer a fairly broad definition of what is appropriate.)
Actually, if you add some nonsense string to the boilerplate like -xaxonerific123, you could use that as a search parameter if for some reason you need to look back and see what's gotten people locked or banned in the past.
In a related topic, you said you've beefed up the security on the YT group. Do the mods want to take over the Google Map, or at least move it to a password setting? It seems there are several off site sites dedicated to this site- The YT Channel/Group, the Facebook Group, the Map. I think we've been pretty clever finding ways to add utility to this site. Is there a way to make it easier to find them? (Maybe on the How-To page you could use screen shots of the Facebook and YT Channel for links.)
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DutchBones
337 posts
Jan 09, 2010
3:48 PM
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@ GH - the way the system works now is that moderators can delete only individual posts (one at the time) but NOT a whole thread ... I don't know what happens if you delete every post in a thread, that might get rid of the original thread... however, deleting 20 or more messages is quite a hassle and very time consuming.... Locking a thread is done by Adam...
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DutchBones Tube
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Buzadero
251 posts
Jan 09, 2010
4:08 PM
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I am humbly honored to be asked. Even more so being termed "level headed".
I would love to. However, you should be aware that I doubt if I would actually impose my will or influence on anything short of ad hominy grit attacks or opinions. I am more inclined to let nature take it's course right up until just this side of a fatality. I am the kind of person who would just sit back and finally come in to destroy the most blatant offender.
And, to come completely clean, you should know that my last straw will probably result in my climbing on a plane and going hunting.
Bear in mind that it can be days or even weeks in some cases when I am in remote areas or on vessels where I have no 'puter access.
With all those caveats and disclaimers out in the open. My answer would be "yes" if that will work for you.
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~Buzadero
Underwater Janitor, Patriot
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tookatooka
979 posts
Jan 09, 2010
5:08 PM
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May I suggest that Moderators could have the ability to remove blatant spam and that anything contentious could be bought to Adams attention (speedily) via email for his consideration after a Moderator has posted a request in the offending post asking people not to add to the thread any further? Just a thought.
Something like:
***ATTENTION***
Please do not add further comments to this thread until it has been reviewed by the forum owner for possible breech of the forum rules. It will be considered OK to continue with this discussion once this notice has been removed.
Thank you for your co-operation.
There could be a Moderator login which would show it's from a moderator and not someone messing around. That way you wouldn't necessarily need to know who the moderator was.
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Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 5:22 PM
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GermanHarpist
909 posts
Jan 09, 2010
5:50 PM
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I like that, tooka.
(i was kinda scared adding something to this thread... ;)
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
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Hobostubs Ashlock
285 posts
Jan 09, 2010
6:00 PM
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hey dont dont become a soup nazi German harpist lol NO SOUP FOR YOU 1 YEAR
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GermanHarpist
910 posts
Jan 09, 2010
6:34 PM
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Ok, seeing that everybody here airs their opinions on how the moderators should act, here is my take:
1. Spam of the "gold" and the 'pharmaceutical' kind should be deleted on the spot. If the thread was started by a spammer the whole thread should be deleted or locked. However, more importantly if the spam was posted on a thread that actually had some harmonica information/discussion, then the spam AND the spam-resulting discussion by the forum members (as in "attention spam", "SPAM, SPAM, SPAM" and the video clip of a Monty Python sketch about spam) should be removed by the moderator so that the discussion can go on unhindered.
2. Trolls of the sandy88 and chopper kind should be labeled as trolls (there could some kind of a Troll- or Blacklist-thread). Once they are on this list their comments can be deleted without warning and threads they started can be locked without discussion.
3. Threads and discussions that get out hand should be locked or 'labeled' with this lock-tag by tooka. To when the thread should be locked I'd like to quote nacoran:
"Warnings first. There are two kinds of warnings: the gentle, lets keep it civil warning and the keep it civil or I'm locking the thread types.
Lock threads second. (//by posting tookas label and contacting Adam//)
Delete only if hate start spilling out into other threads. Although sometimes a 'lets fix this' thread might be OK, it's just when an argument in a speaker thread starts spilling out into other on-topic threads that it's really a problem. "
" Ban only if one person keeps doing it over and over. " In this case I would just put them on the Troll-list (after several warnings of course and if the other moderators agree).
Btw. what do you guys think about electing moderators?
In any case I would go for more than two moderators. Buzadero is diving around the remote areas of our world and me too I have some times (like in a month or so) where I have exams and less time to spend on MBH.
If I had to choose I would go for TOOKATOOKA and NACORAN as extra moderators. Both are very accomplished MBH-members and in my eyes absolutely capable of doing the job.
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 6:45 PM
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kudzurunner
931 posts
Jan 09, 2010
6:47 PM
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Buzadero:
Since there's more than one moderator, I'm OK with the fact that you'll be away sometimes, if you're OK with it. As long as you're willing to intervene on occasion, working from your innate sense of justice, that's fine.
@Germanharpist: You're trying to systematize. Interesting. I'm not sure that's needed. Don't worry quite so much about the community's wishes, or about achieving unerring consistency. Rough justice will do just fine. Think of the moderators, including yourself, as my deputies. This is the Wild West, and that's OK.
I'll spell out the role of the moderators. It's pretty easy:
1) Read and internalize the board creed, which sits at the top of the forum homepage. That's our constitution for the time being, and it's a rough enough approximation of "workable" that it can function as your guide
2) When you believe that somebody has stepped over the line vis a vis the board creed, use your discretion to do one of several things: a) warn them, gently and in the thread in question, that they've overstepped, and suggest that they edit or delete the offending post; b) in cases where the offense is either flagrant, willful, or repeated, delete the offending post. You may append a warning to the thread, too.
When in doubt, presume the best of people rather than the worst. That, too, is part of the board creed.
So, for example, presume that Hobostubs is just being silly when he urges you not to become a kind of Nazi, rather than deliberately and unwisely inflammatory. :( Give him a chance to see the error of his ways.
I hope these guidelines work for you. I certainly appreciate your willingness to serve.
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GermanHarpist
911 posts
Jan 09, 2010
6:50 PM
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Tooka, I don't think we need a moderator login. We all know who the moderators are/will be and I think their name beside the tag should be enough.
Nacoran, I will work over the forum how-to to include the facebook group, update links, etc.
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 7:11 PM
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Hobostubs Ashlock
286 posts
Jan 09, 2010
6:58 PM
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I was just joking about the episode of Seinfeld about the soup nazi,But then again he might of not seen Seinfeld where hes at.I firgured it fit the situation in a humurous way sorry if taken wrong
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GermanHarpist
912 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:00 PM
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Adam, I like your guidelines and I think they should do the job.
As mentioned above, if you don't mind and if Tooka and Nacoran are willing I'd very much like to add them to the moderators team. We've seen that moderators can catch a lot of flack for their decisions... Some extra support would be very helpful in times when Buzadero is diving around the world or I'm trying to bribe my professors into giving me better grades ;).
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 8:00 PM
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gene
346 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:12 PM
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Just for the fun of it, I wish one of the moderators would change his username to Barnry Fife. :)
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Hobostubs Ashlock
287 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:22 PM
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but he could only have one bullet though lol
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nacoran
760 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:31 PM
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I wouldn't mind helping out if needed, but sometimes it's better to keep things simple. If too many people have keys to the kingdom more people get upset if they don't get a set too.
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GermanHarpist
913 posts
Jan 09, 2010
7:37 PM
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Nacoran, I recognize your concern, however I rather see it as always having somebody around to keep the peace.
We saw how it went last time when we had three moderators. Two were never around and one quit because he didn't want to take the pressure.
I think having one or two extra moderators wouldn't be bad at all...
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
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Zhin
377 posts
Jan 09, 2010
9:30 PM
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I think GermanHarpist and Buz are good people and are good for the job.
I had the pleasure of meeting Buz and hanging out with him at SPAH and he is indeed a very level-headed individual. I had a blast hanging out with him during that hectic crazy harmonica week.
I believe the forums are in good hands and am happy with the newly appointed moderators.
I'm also glad that the burden of moderating is lifted from Ductchbones... For some of you who don't know, he's a school teacher. He's already got his own flock to tend to, let him enjoy the harp here. :)
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http://www.youtube.com/harmonicazhin
Last Edited by on Jan 09, 2010 9:33 PM
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Bluzdude46
357 posts
Jan 10, 2010
2:34 AM
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I'm glad I'm not the only one. For a week I felt obligated to be here every waking hour just to miss someone Flaming everyone the monment I sign out. For the record I have deleted threads one post at a time from a previously mentioned character. If no one noticed all the better. We saved everyone the disgust.
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Bluzdude46
358 posts
Jan 10, 2010
2:54 AM
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Also for the record I deleted The "Ink" thread that Adam locked. It got to the point of members arguing over how it should be handled by Moderators. Not necessary and I don't mind being the bad guy. If anyone has issues it can be addressed at my email Bluzdude46@aol.com
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tookatooka
980 posts
Jan 10, 2010
3:15 AM
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Many thanks for your vote of confidence GH but even if Adam did offer me a "moderatorship" (made up word) I would have to decline. Once HPC3 is over I'm intending to take a back seat on the forum. I've spent too much time on here and I've let my art interests slip. I need to adjust my priorities and focus on my business again.
Thanks anyway. It was kind of you.
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GermanHarpist
919 posts
Jan 10, 2010
7:38 AM
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Of course, tooka, I understand...
For effective moderating I think that there should always be a moderator around.
I'm pretty active at the moment, however, there are times where I too have other things to deal with.
So that IMO still leaves us (at least) one moderator short. Any volunteers?
Nacoran? C'mon man, don't leave me hanging here.
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
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Hobostubs Ashlock
292 posts
Jan 10, 2010
7:56 AM
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hey GermanHarpist
i didnt mean nothing bad about the soup nazi,its from a comedy tv show here in the states,I have a few relatives that grew up in Germany.I hope i didnt affend no one it was not my intention,Anyway sorry hey you know what ASHLOCK means in German lol
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tookatooka
981 posts
Jan 10, 2010
8:46 AM
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GH I'll still give my support and help whenever possible. That goes without saying.
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oda
162 posts
Jan 10, 2010
8:56 AM
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Great. I think GH is a level-headed dude. I don't know the other fella.
Perhaps you mods can put your contact info on your signatures now? so we can contact you with concerns/questions -- and not have to worry about digging through youtube pages and what not. Just a thought.
here here.
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oda
163 posts
Jan 10, 2010
9:11 AM
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Adam,
If you want to make this a little more fun, I highly suggest you try this out:
http://www.google.com/a/cpanel/domain/new
This is an app provided by google. It allows you (for free) to make emails @yourwebsite.com , and you use google's servers to sign in. So really, all you have to do is visit the above link and follow the instructions to set it up. It's easy. And that way the mods and their future comrades can have a shiny @modernbluesharmonica.com email.
You'll also get a special link to sign in which you can customize with this sites colors & logo. There is so many possibilities :) heck, I think you get like 100 free emails @ your domain, you can even use it as a way to give away the rest of the emails as prizes or something. Do what you will.
Again, just a thought, I'm not telling you folks what to do! just trying to help out :)
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phogi
170 posts
Jan 10, 2010
9:18 AM
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I've been on many forums over the years. The best are the ones with the strictest moderation. I've yet to see a forum with too strict moderation.
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MJ
62 posts
Jan 10, 2010
10:20 AM
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"I've been on many forums over the years. The best are the ones with the strictest moderation. I've yet to see a forum with too strict moderation. "
phogi,... Too strict can be a sticky thing. I was on the Epiphone forum last year for a while, when the moderators began banning members for speaking ill in any way about the Epiphone branded products. There is a point when "moderation" goes beyond its very name. Civility is lost easily in an anonomous setting such as the internet. I sometimes wonder if some of the statements I read on this forum would be made if it were face to face and eye to eye. Much like flipping off someone from the anonimity of your car, making wild immature and sometimes threatening statements to your keyboard, is way too easy. Humor and wit has its place and is a great thing as long as it is not at the expense of others. I say, Peace, Goodwill, Empathy and a touch of Maturity are in order.
Last Edited by on Jan 10, 2010 3:20 PM
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nacoran
763 posts
Jan 10, 2010
10:51 AM
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GH- I guess I do spend a lot of time here anyway.
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GermanHarpist
920 posts
Jan 10, 2010
2:37 PM
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Thanks narcoran.
Tooka, that's good to know. :)
Adam, I hope you're ok with having nacoran as a third moderator. Let's do it!
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Jan 10, 2010 2:38 PM
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GermanHarpist
921 posts
Jan 10, 2010
2:39 PM
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Hobostock Ashlock, no worries. Btw. "Arschloch" is what you're going for... close enough. ;)
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
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kudzurunner
933 posts
Jan 10, 2010
2:52 PM
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Yes, I'll put him online right now.
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nacoran
767 posts
Jan 10, 2010
10:16 PM
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Oda- I'm on hotmail with the same handle, and on Facebook, but you'll probably find me faster here!
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GermanHarpist
931 posts
Jan 11, 2010
7:02 AM
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If anybody has comments or reactions that they don't want to post on the forum feel free to contact me at ' germanharpist (at) gmail.com '.
EDIT: The address is on my profile too.
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germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Jan 11, 2010 7:18 AM
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