I think at some point I mentioned that I stopped using effects for amplified playing. This is a very recent recording I made from a jam with my current amplified tone.
What do you guys think?
Should I use a little reverb or delay with it? I'm honestly standing on the fence with this one.
I like the sound of echoes and that fuzzyness it can have but at the same time I love the solid and deliberate sound I'm getting without the 'verb or delay.
I would appreciate opinions on this please. Thanks!
Gear used: HG Rock Bottom (12AX7), EV 660, Zhin Custom Hohner Blues Harp MS
Nice work Zhin. For my taste a little delay on the sound although not too much (just to fatten it out a little) would be nice. I would avoid reverb as it would put it too far back in the mix I would think.
Get a decent delay and use it when you feel like it. Lol. I go through this all the time too. In general, if it is a dead room or we are playing a quiet gig, then I use delay. If it is loud or we are in a room that is lively, then no.
When recording, I've done with delay, lots of delay, and no delay. In that situation, it depends on if I want a raw sound or not. My "blues" tone would be dry...rock or funk would be with delay. ---------- Mike Fugazzi http://www.myspace.com/niterailband http://www.youtube.com/user/NiteRail http://www.twitter.com/NiteRail http://www.facebook.com/mike.fugazzi
I completely agree.I would always go as minimal as you can tolerate. I trust my soundguy to add effects if they are needed, but playing live, most rooms don't need reverb/delay at all. It just makes feedback worse and muddies the mix.
It's the same thing with stage volume, if it's all coming from the backline the soundguy loses control.
Recording wise, remember it's easier to add than take away. Once you've done a take and put the effects in yourself, you have committed yourself to that sound. You will have to re-record if you're unhappy with the effects later on in the mixing stage.
"It's the same thing with stage volume, if it's all coming from the backline the soundguy loses control."
This may be the single biggest band-killer and the hardest one to get folks to buy into.
I am a sound guy...long before I ever played harp. I can tell you stories about gigs that bands will never return to because they refused to believe this. "too loud" and the sound guy had no control of anything but the vocals as a result, which also become too loud or simply get lost.
If you have a sound guy, I say let him add your delay, recorded or live, if it's a big room and you are mic'd. If it's a tiny stage in a tiny room and there's only enough PA for the vocals, add your own with care....less is often more.
It depends on stage situation, amp quality (if I don't have mine with me) and music style. If I play jazz and classical it often sounds good to play straight to PA. If I play something experimental I occasionally use long delay, pitch shifter, phase shifter (not at the same time) to two amps.
Zhin, my man! I will give you my unprofessional opinion. I prefer a totally ALL AMP tone. Of course, I use the HarpAttack but it has a tube in it which is similar to one in the HarpGear. I use it and my LPB-1 almost as attenuators, and if I need more distortion I use the HarpAttack to drive it before feedback. Seriously, in my opinion, I think the best way to decide an amps tone is by using an A harp or a G harp and just wailing on the 4 draw. It makes the amp work. Personally, I think this sounds really good, sounds QUITE similar to my amp. Zhin, that last video of you playing that smoky blues thing...Dude, I gotta be honest, that sucked compared to this. THAT IS NOT AN INSULT. Dude, you wanna talk about awesome playing, here ya go. The last one you were obviously like "oh man, I gotta do this and this, and NOW this," and it shows. This one just seems perfect. This totally rules. I say use effects like octave and stuff when it agrees with the music, but I never got the delay thing unless it was crazy delay or you're trying to sound like Little Walter. This is great stuff Zhin, quite amazing how much you've improved since last January when we met!
My harp effects pedal board has a delay, reverb and Bassman pedal. I usually want delay and a little reverb. I use the Bassman pedal occasionally with my Champ clone because the Champ only has a volume knob, the pedal lets me adjust the tone.
Last Edited by on Jan 19, 2010 12:59 PM
I'm really taken aback by the responses. You guys are great!
Tomorrow I'll be checking out a local music store to help and teach 2 local harp players (Eddy and Zarul) how pick a decent budget amp for amplified harp. We're all bringing our mics so it's gonna be a blast causing a ruckus in the music store... hehehe...
While I'm there I might as well try out their effect pedals. I'm keeping my mind open so I may end up walking home with some kind of pedal... or not.
Though in general I think I will do what I can to preserve the tone and dynamics I'm getting right now. Anything that degrades it will be out of the question.
Thanks again guys. Your opinions really do help and count. It did help me be more aware of the fact that I have a good thing going with my amp'ed tone right now and shouldn't mess it up too much.
I thought I posted this on a thread about the BBE sonic stomp but it disappeared. So here goes again, sort of.
I have always played with a delay pedal. A year or so ago I got the BBE Sonic Stomp and wow, it was sorta cool - so I continued using it for most of the last year. One night not too far back we had a gig, and after the gig I was asked to play at a jam nearby. I didn't feel like setting everything up again so I just plugged straight into my amp - pedal-less. IT SOUNDED GREAT!
It was then I realized.... I usually like something that is new and different. Even if it is old.
In a previous career I did some user interface design for software. I read a marvelous book on the subject called "The psychology of every day things". I highly recommend it if you're doing UI work. In it they referenced a study that illustrated my point above. Researchers went into a workplace and added lights, making it brighter. Productivity went up. After a few months they went back and added some more lights making it brighter still. Productivity went up. And a few months after that they came in and removed some of the lights. Productivity WENT UP!!! The conclusion was that the workers all liked change they perceived was being made on their behalf.
And my point is - just because its cool at first doesn't mean you'll love it forever - you just get used to it. Try going straight into your amp again if you haven't been for a while. Like me, you might just love it.
I figure in a few months, I'll plug one or both pedals back in. AND I'll probably like it. But at least knowing about this helps me spend huge sums of money on stuff I really don't need.
Greg, I'm aware of how changing things up can have a great effect on motivation and productivity. I see this occurring the most in me when I'm learning songs and techniques. I find that I must not spend too much time on anything too specific or the inspiration runs out very quick.
In this case I find I have some pretty solid reasons which have led me to conclude that I don't like certain effects.
One of things that really bugs me about delay and echoes is the fact that when I abruptly stop any note, without any effects can have such a dramatic effect. That sudden silence. I like that a lot. With any kind of echo/delay/verb you hear this "ping" of your own note that can sound very random at times when playing with a band.
Say the band goes real silent and I hit the last note in perfect timing to the band... only to have that slapback echo repeat my note... the whole band just gives me that one look like "thanks for ruining the atmosphere". It makes me look bad like as if I must have the last note to play. lol
The other thing as well, I'm absolutely certain that my phrasing and lines are in better shape because I'm not too distracted by the echo sounds (not everyone is like this but I am).
I am also very aware of the fact that our taste does change quite dramatically as we experience and learn new things.
Despite that I still believe I could use an effect or two. I believe in having some variety in my sound.
I appreciate your feedback and wisdom Greg. Thank you for chiming in!
