Hey, wanting to do some low end vamping kinda stuff and thinking about getting a couple of harps to do it. I have some low harps on order from Buddha that I'm looking forward to, but also wondering about these. So, what's the differnce between these models? Is the SBS better for doing a low riff and then duplicating it up in the regular part of the harp? Help, I is cornfused. -Bob
Last Edited by on Mar 08, 2010 6:06 PM
SBS is like the bottom four holes of a regular low harp grafted onto a regular 10-hole in the regular key. I have one that is cool to play with, but I don't really play it regularly.
The 14-holer low harp is the same as the 12-holer, which is cheaper--except it has a couple of extra (useless to me) holes on the high end. This is the harp I use to do stuff like my impression of Sonny boy's "Bye Bye Bird" on. They are really great harps, but the regular low harps are just as good, unless you want to do stuff on the high end.
For low vamping, I prefer the low C 12-holer--the SBS is just for playing Shortnin' Bread--with a vamp that alternates between low and regular vamps. . .
The Marine Band 365/28 is quite large. I bought one just because I was at a store that had them, and it's cool. But I think that a low harp like Seydel sells would serve me better since I haven't been using the high end.
From Harp-L: Below is the layout for the C 365/28
Deleted - mine was wrong, and poorly formatted
Last Edited by on Mar 09, 2010 8:14 AM
The difference that I noticed was that once you go above the 5 hole on the normal 12 and 14 holes MBs the notes aren't what you expect and don't work with a normal blues song. On the SBS he has retuned the reeds and you can draw bend right up to the 10 draw. The SBS's are much better suited to blues but above the 5 hole they are tuned differently but still suited to any blues track.
The 364 and 365 are great for Son of Dave type loops on the low holes and the SBS are great for any blues tunes.
I have a SBS in C I believe the first 3 holes are simply an octive lower than a standard C diatonic, then the next ten are the same with hole 14 higher again. I know I really like how it sounds, its definately a lot of fun!
Does anyone understand the apparent discrepancies in hole 14 of the SBS and 11 upwards of the 365? ---------- germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
GH this may not help your question, but its all Hohner has on their website about this particular harp.
The famous Steve Baker Special extended blues tuning. The "Steve Baker Special" (SBS) uses the same construction as the classic Marine Band 365, but the sound range is extended downwards instead of upwards. Thus it features an additional lower octave with identical tuning and bending capabilities as for channels 1-3, but one octave lower. This allows for typical phrasings by using draw bends to be played over a range of 2 octaves.
For the G and A major harmonicas, think of a high tuned harmonica with an extra octave in the lower range.
It's the B (in 11d with the 365 and 14d with the SBS) that bothers me. It just doesn't make sense... especially with the 365, cos then all notes upwards get tangled. I would rather just take the B out and move all draw notes one down.
IMO wrong layouts:
MB C 365/28 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 ========================================================= BLOW | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ DRAW | D | G | B | D | F | A | B | D | F | A | B | D | F | A | =========================================================
MB C SBS 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 ========================================================= BLOW | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ DRAW | D | G | B | D | G | B | D | F | A | B | D | F | A | B | =========================================================
And the corrected layouts, with the B removed and all draw notes shifted down one hole. This would give you a an extra octave at the top (11-13) with the same layout as holes 8-10 and of course the extra 14th hole starting over.
MB C 365/28 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 ========================================================= BLOW | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ DRAW | D | G | B | D | F | A | B | D | F | A | D | F | A | D | =========================================================
MB C SBS 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 ========================================================= BLOW | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ DRAW | D | G | B | D | G | B | D | F | A | B | D | F | A | D | =========================================================
Does anybody have one of the two harps on hand to confirm either of the two layouts?
MB C 365/28 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 ========================================================= BLOW | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ DRAW | D | G | B | D | F | A | B | D | F | A | B | D | F | A | =========================================================
MB C SBS 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 ========================================================= BLOW | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | G | C | E | +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ DRAW | D | G | B | D | G | B | D | F | A | B | D | F | A | B | =========================================================
GH asks "Can anybody confirm that?"
Yes, I have both harps, and I can confirm that these are the correct layouts. I wouldn't worry about the top octave on the 365/28 - it's useless, but it does make for some wacky blow-bnds! The only thing I'm not too happy about with the SBS is that 5 draw - you can bend it down to get an F of course, but it results in uninteresting tonic chords without any tension, whereas on the 365/28 the F gives the far more interesting minor 7th chord. ---------- Kinda hot in these rhinos!
Last Edited by on Mar 09, 2010 2:49 PM
exactly the steve baker special doesn't allow you to blues warble the 4 and 5th hole draw in the lower octave unless you bend the fifth hole down to the minor seventh and that doesnt quite sound right- but you can do that in the second octave which is just like a diatonic. however you can still do some pretty cool things with the sbs and you could swap it out for the standard 14 hole or twelve hole marine band just to play that warble. for me Ive found that the 14 hole marine band is thinner than the 12 and I like the feel of that harp better, i dont use the extra top notes anyway but it gives you a little more control on bending the low end.
Why would anybody design a layout like this?!? Besides the fact that there are intervals of up to an 5th between the draw and the blow note how do you play the major scale starting on hole 10blow?
C - 10b D - 12d E - 11b F - 13d G - 12b A - 14d B - some impossible bend on hole 13 C - 13b
You would be jumping all over the place... What's going on here?
---------- germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Mar 09, 2010 10:04 PM
The only reason I see of using that layout is that you can play the same chords continuously... But who plays chords up there anyway? Now you're stuck with a useless bunch of single notes... I'm confused.
"but it does make for some wacky blow-bnds!" Laugh my ass off! ---------- germanharpist on YT. =;-) - Resonance is KEY!
Last Edited by on Mar 09, 2010 10:22 PM
