therue
2 posts
Jan 25, 2016
10:48 PM
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I've been whistling ever sine I could remember and am extremely good at it- vibratos, improvising and whistling along to any genre of music, hitting low/high notes. Does this translate well into harmonica by any chance?
Anyways, I'm very interested in learning diatonic harmonica, especially overblows once all the fundamentals are there.
My question is, what diatonic harmonica would you guys recommend for a beginner who is not just thinking about trying out the instrument for fun to see if he likes it or not, but someone who is pretty serious about it and is willing to put in a good deal of effort daily into his practice? (I literally whistled as a kid daily, whenever I get the chance, so whistling became second nature rather quickly, and I hope to do the same with harmonica as well.)
At the moment, I'm looking at Suzuki Manji and Suzuki Promaster.The Manji is about$35 while the promaster is about $44 - the difference in price is pretty negligible to me since they are almost identical.... but which of the two would you guys recommend? (I'm opened to other suggestions as well of course.)
In addition, should I just buy one harmonica in C? or should i go for a 3 set, or 4 set right off the bat? since suzuki seems to be on sale at the moment.
As a beginner practicing, how soon will I need a harmonica in different key ? or will C allow me to practice for a really long time.
Lastly, how often will i need to clean the harmonica? Is it a simple process? and will I need to worry about replacement reeds in the future?
The type of music I'm interested in playing is similar to this: I know it will take some time for sure ^_^
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjQxTFNh_14
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MindTheGap
1039 posts
Jan 26, 2016
12:47 AM
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Hi therue and welcome.
I would have thought that the ability to whistle is an excellent thing to help with learning harmonica. Firstly, because you will have a good sense of pitch and a good ear. The harmonica is an odd instrument in that some notes are apparently given in tune for you, and some you have to find the pitch and adjust it in play. In fact all the notes are malleable to some degree.
Secondly, one of the features people like in the harp sound is a really nice vibrato. There are different ways to create it, but one of them is produced in the mouth, which I believe is similar to the way you do it for whistling. Particularly for that lovely single-note, melody sound you refer to.
I'm going to leave the questions about harmonica choices and maintenance to others. These are great questions and there is a lot to say.
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Glass Harp Full
90 posts
Jan 26, 2016
2:07 AM
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Welcome to the forum therue!
You're unlikely to get a single answer to your questions as everyone will have their own views. I haven't played a Manji or a Promaster, but I can recommend the Suzuki Bluesmaster as a great harp to start out on. It's comfortable to hold and play, and the hole spacing is slightly larger than some other brands of harp making single notes easier to get.
There was a thread not long ago about whether beginners should get just one harp or a few different keys so you might like to look at that. Most instructional materials are designed for a C harp so you can get a lot of mileage out of it. I'd say start out with a C harp and if you like it get other keys then.
I do a simple clean each time I play involving tapping out the harp to get out any excess moisture and wiping it with a lint free cloth. I take them apart and rinse in water when they start to sound funny. How often depends on how often and how long you play. Others here know much more about harp maintenance than me and would be able to give more details.
These are just my opinions and I'm sure others will differ. All the best with your harp journey.
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Rontana
271 posts
Jan 26, 2016
4:46 AM
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For those just starting out, I would advise buying two harmonicas, both of them in the key of C (that's what you'll be using for a while). Get one harp that is of the tin-sandwich design (such as the classic Hohner Marine Band) and get one with recessed reed plates (such as a Hohner Special 20, a Suzuki Harpmaster, or Bushman Delta Frost).
The reason, is that some people have trouble with the tin-sandwich style - the slightly extended reed plates can be tough on the lips of beginners - and they also tend to grab at beards/moustaches.
Also, be aware that the 2-hole of your new harp is not broken . . . it just takes a lot of practice before it sounds the way you think it should (most everyone thinks they have a broken 2-draw when starting out)
Most important . . . just have fun with it, take your time, and don't expect huge leaps overnight. Don't concern yourself with overblows and such just yet; get all the basics down first. If possible, invest in either some 1-on-1 or Skype lessons. They're well worth the money, especially for folks just starting out.
You can learn a huge amount on your own and via download lessons (Adam Gussow's download lessons on this site are fantastic) but in the beginning it's immensely helpful to have a teacher to guide you through the fundamentals (how you're holding the harp. proper breathing, posture, etc. etc. etc.) These are small things, but immensely important.
Like with any instrument, starting with improper form will ingrain improper form, and nothing is more frustrating than having to forget what you think is right and relearn something else.
Hope that helps
Last Edited by Rontana on Jan 26, 2016 4:50 AM
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Ian
248 posts
Jan 26, 2016
5:01 AM
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I'd echo everything thats been said above.
If you played alone and we're happy noodling along like that then in some ways you would never need another key than c.
If you want to follow jam tracks, a wider variety of teaching materials or maybe play with others then you will need more keys.
C, A, G is a good starting set.
Rontanas idea if getting a recessed plate harp and a tin sandwich harp is a good one. However be wary of your decisions after you have tried them both if they are in different keys. A harp in A will feel and play very differently to a harp in c.
I have never played a promaster but they are very similar to a bluesmaster other than the metal comb construction. The bluesmaster is a very nice harp to play, very easy on the lips, very well made, seemingly always well gapped (something you will learn about in time)... Plus it's cheap!
The manji is a great harp. I have 7 and I enjoy playing them very much.
More difficult in some respects to play as a begginner than the bluesmaster, due to the construction and the very tight reed slots which can jam up with spit if you don't play dry enough.
They have a dirty tone though that is fairly unique. The bluesmaster and promaster are sweeter and cleaner.
Have fun though!
Last Edited by Ian on Jan 26, 2016 5:02 AM
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Crawforde
49 posts
Jan 26, 2016
5:28 AM
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Also, whatever you decide, don't be stubborn.
At the beginning you may decide you prefer one type, brand, model.... over all others.
You will probably change your mind numerous times.
Just relax, hit the notes, have some fun.
One of Adam's beginner's packages is a good place to start.
Get a chromatic too ??
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Killa_Hertz
349 posts
Jan 26, 2016
5:30 AM
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Unfortunatelyi don't have time for a long answer right now. But my simple answer would be Special 20 in C. And that one harmonica should be sufficient for atleast a month or two before you need to buy a second one in a different key.
Focus first on how the notes sound goin up and down the harp. Try making up lil beats.
Then focus on single notes. This will take a while. Once you get single notes focus on improving your embouchure.
Very good point Ron brought up about the 2 hole. It's not broken. The 2draw just takes a specific way to play it in order to sound right.
Buy one of Adams beginner videos or Ronnie Shellists beginner vid off harmonica123.com.
Hit youtube relentlessly and gather all the info you can. Take your time to learn things correctly in the beginning as everything from here on out depends on these skills. Make that first harp last a while before you get lost in the "harmonica trials"
Check back in and ask questions if you get sick or frustrated.
Happy Harpin Bro!
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"Trust Those Who Seek The Truth. Doubt Those Who Say They Have Found It."
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Spderyak
66 posts
Jan 26, 2016
5:42 AM
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therue, again your you tube link does not work (at least for me) but that's ok.
Most the harps mentioned I think you would find ok.
If you have whiskers... harps that are nice smooth with no gaps at the corner ends tend to be more user friendly.
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Killa_Hertz
351 posts
Jan 26, 2016
5:53 AM
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Also i wanted to mention that you want to breathe through the harp not suck. Breath from deep Down in your diaphragm with am open throat and airway. If your do this from the start it may be easier than having to learn it later. This is also how you make the 2draw sound. If you suck it will sound flat and off.
There are many other thing i could add, but i don't want to make it too complicated.
Just buy a special 20 in C and find a Raw Begginer Lesson. And you ll be ok. The special 20 will be fine for any type of music and will be something you won't regret purchasing. 8^)>
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"Trust Those Who Seek The Truth. Doubt Those Who Say They Have Found It."
Last Edited by Killa_Hertz on Jan 26, 2016 5:54 AM
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ME.HarpDoc
103 posts
Jan 26, 2016
5:29 PM
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therue
All good advice. I love the Bluesmaster and find it easier to bend notes than some others. Montana mentioned a Marine Band as a classic sandwich type harp. There'll be a lot of discussion on harps on this forum but I might suggest that when you're starting, you may want to avoid wooden comes (e.g. Marine Band) as they have the potential to swell with moisture which you'll produce plenty of when learning (although this may not be as much of a problem with newer models as it used to be now that they are sealed better. And they do sound great). The Manji has sandwich construction and a composite comb which won't swell.
As an aside, please scroll down on the beginner forum page to "Introductions" and tell us a little about yourself and where you live.
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Mirco
372 posts
Jan 26, 2016
11:23 PM
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SP20 is the best value. It's a good entry level harp that pros also use to get a great sound, but not expensive.
You should get either an A or a C to start (maybe both). You'll likely learn your first blues licks in 2nd position. That means you'll be playing the C harp in key of G, a common key for guitarists. Also, many instructional materials call for a C harp.
The A harp will allow you to play your 2nd position blues licks in the key of E, most common key for blues musicians. And there's some good instructional material written for A harmonicas (most notable is Dave Barrett's bluesharmonica.com).
If you end up getting a Hohner harmonica, you'll probably get the card for a free month of bluesharmonica.com. Try it out. By the end of the month, you'll know if harmonica is for you or not.
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Marc Graci
YouTube Channel
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Rontana
272 posts
Jan 27, 2016
5:06 AM
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"If you end up getting a Hohner harmonica, you'll probably get the card for a free month of bluesharmonica.com. Try it out. By the end of the month, you'll know if harmonica is for you or not."
I'd have to offer a slight disagreement with that statement, just because I don't want a new player to risk undue discouragement.
Lots of people love Dave Barrett, and no doubt he's an excellent teacher and brilliant musician. However, If I had spent my first month using his site ( and I did research it, and did consider it, before opting for 1-on1 lessons) I would not have been too happy.
The very strong emphasis on the tongue blocking technique - which seems to the hallmark of the Barrett program - is not for everybody. An introduction to harp should include a combination of lip pursing and tongue blocking . . . if for no other reason than to allow the new player to decide which is most comfortable and enjoyable for them.
It's simply not a "one size fits all" or "this way of that way" proposition.
Both techniques work well, and for many folks, a combination of the two is the preferred route. Therue has told us he has an established strength as a whistler. To me, that would indicate that lip pursing might be more in his wheel house.
Again . . . the main point is to follow the route that allows you to have the most fun
Last Edited by Rontana on Jan 27, 2016 5:23 AM
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Ian
250 posts
Jan 27, 2016
8:50 AM
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I started with Mitch Graingers youtube and online lessons.
http://www.mitchgrainger.com
They are free (optional donations) and really rather brilliant. As individual lessons go , the best I have come across.
Unfortunately he seems to have stopped doing them now after having taken them up to a lower intermediate level. I'm guessing that his touring schedule took over.
There are tab sheets and other resources on his website to go with the lessons.
I'd recommend having a look.
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Killa_Hertz
365 posts
Jan 27, 2016
9:50 AM
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I agree with rontana with the Dave Barret lessons.
Therue ... for very begginer lessons If you want something free. I went through all these lessons on youtube posted by username FunkyHarp. His name is Luke and his lessons are good for beginner level. Also check out all of Jon Gindicks videos.
He had this one video that teaches a 3b 3d 4b 4d lick and how to alternate them and make different rythms. I found this very helpful at first. U just stick with these two holes and make all you can out of them. I think this is great practice and a great example of what the harp is. A limited number of notes that you must make the most of.
Just don't forget to check in here and ask questions. I think alot of people get off track and frustrated which causes them to quit. Just keep progressing slowly forward and you ll be good.
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"Trust Those Who Seek The Truth. Doubt Those Who Say They Have Found It."
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Rontana
273 posts
Jan 27, 2016
10:02 AM
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+1 on Jon Gindick.
His "Rock N' Blues" harmonica is one of the best books out there. Its been around since at least the year 2000, and if not the best-selling harp book of all time, I've no doubt it's in the top 5.
And, as Khz noted, JG has some excellent videos online
I believe Jon also offers Skype lessons, and he holds popular jam camps several times a year (3 are scheduled for 2016 in Clarksdale, MS).
Last Edited by Rontana on Jan 27, 2016 10:06 AM
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Halffast
17 posts
Jan 27, 2016
1:20 PM
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therue
Some great advice here so far . I'm pretty new to this too but I'll throw in my 2 cents based on what I've learned so far .
I'm a whistler too !That's the only musical experience I had before picking up a harp last summer . I find it helps me a LOT . When I can't practice with a harp , I'll whistle the tune but now I draw in and blow out exactly as with a harp . Vibrato , tongue slapping ,bending , warbling , etc. can almost all b be practiced whistling .
A hohner SP20 is a work horse and very affordable . Get an A,C,G three pack because if you get hooked right away ( as I did : had 7 harps within 3 months ) you'll be wanting to play songs in other keys and these should cover a good many of them .
All my harps have plastic combs so if I play one for quite a while I'll soak it in a glass of water with a splash of vodka in hopes of killing any nasties that may be lurking ( or at least get them drunk enough to let go ) . You should learn to take your harps apart too . You can clean them up better this way and you'll probably be doing some gapping & tuning eventually anyway .
Learned my first few songs by searching harp tab + the song title . I do not read music so tabs fill the bill for me . Also look up things like harmonica blues riffs , rock riffs , and videos of some of the old and modern great harp players . There seem to be youtube videos available for about anything and everything pertaining to harmonicas .
Most of all have fun . Glean what you can from the myriad of opinions you'll find . Develop your own style of playing that you enjoy .
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Mirco
373 posts
Jan 28, 2016
3:58 PM
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Good comments, especially regarding Dave Barrett's site. And thanks for disagreeing in a civil way.
I actually see your point that Dave's site could be a bit much for a raw beginner. You're better off holding onto that card and purchasing either one of Gindick's books or Gussow's "Beginner's Special" on here. If you like Gussow's approach, dig into his many YouTube videos or buy some of his video/tabs on sale.
In three months, try out bluesharmonica.com and see if it's for you. Good luck!
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Marc Graci
YouTube Channel
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