|
beginner forum: for novice and developing blues harp players >
Separating the tongue and throat
Separating the tongue and throat
Page:
1
Killa_Hertz
583 posts
Feb 19, 2016
6:54 AM
|
I mentioned this in another thread, but it needs it own. So here goes. AGAIN CUS CAPTCHA EFFIN ATE THE FIRST ONE
Anyways the short version this time.
Iwas talking to the great Winslow Zerxa and i asked him about playing with an open throat. And if he had any excersises. And also how to bend while doin this because my bends dont hold the tone because i cant keep my throat open at the same time. He told me that the reason is that most people flex thier throat. But this is unnecessary. You bend with just your tongue, so you should practice separating the two. He says that when he was learning throat vibrato on bent notes it would always come out choppy until he learned to separate the two. So this (to me) was a good way to learn to keep my throat open while bending. Add vibrato. Its harder than it sounds to separate the two functions.
But in doing this another problem arose. I find it hard to bend with my jaw lowered without using my throat. It seems there is too much space between the roof of my mouth and tongue. I find that if i raise my jaw closer to normal resting position, it becomes much easier to bend with the throat open. But with an obvious sacrifice of tone. So now I'm also trying to find a solution to this problem.
Anyways, thought ide share. If anyone has Any i input or has figured this out. Lmk.
Here is the thread where i asked him these questions. If your interested.
http://www.bluesharmonica.com/keeping_open_pathway
----------
"Trust Those Who Seek The Truth. Doubt Those Who Say They Have Found It."
Last Edited by Killa_Hertz on Feb 19, 2016 6:56 AM
|
ME.HarpDoc
122 posts
Feb 19, 2016
7:33 AM
|
I'm still struggling to bend to pitch, but I do tend to sepa ate my throat from my tongue, although I wasn't aware I was doing that until your post.
What I did, and maybe this will be helpful to you, was pick the key and hole that was easiest for me to bend (in my case hole 1 on an A Suzuki Harpmaster) and practice using only my tongue to bend paying attention to keeping my throat open, jaw lowered, harp deep in mouth, etc.. Let me know if any of that helps.
|
Killa_Hertz
584 posts
Feb 19, 2016
10:38 AM
|
Actually i think i kinda figured it out at lunch sittin in the car.
What was happening was.... i could keep my mouth and throat open, and while drawing in, move my tongue back and forth and literally cause nothing to happen. So i thought that i must have been bending with my throat. But when you think about it your tongue goes farther back than just whats in your mouth.
The bend that i thought was being caused by my throat was actually just the very back of my tongue. So it was in my throat. Just not my throat muscles. Once i figured this out, i can hit a pretty good vibrato while bending now. Still will take some getting used to.
The thing i don't like is that even though i am using my tongue, it still has to pretty well block of the throat to bend. (Not sure if this is correct, but it's what's Goin on.) So therefore the sound chamber your trying to create by keeping the throat open is now being partially blocked. It actually feels like my tongue is closing it off entirely when i do it. But i actually checked the spacing with my finger. ( wierd i know) it actually closes by slightly more than half, but its not as closed as it feels.
Also when playing a regular note i would have my jaw dropped, throat open, and tongue down and flat. But i used to have to raise my tongue to bend. So i was blocking off the chamber in my mouth also. Now i don't have to move the part of my tongue that's in my mouth at all.
So to better describe the spot I'm using, its kinda right where your tongue goes down your throat. Ive heard people say the back of your tongue before, but ive always envisioned it further up than where I'm at now. It FEELS like it's down my throat. Like right atop my adams apple.
I dunno try it. Mess with vibrato. If you can hit a pretty clean vibrato while bent you should be good. I say while bent because during the bend there is a lil hickup. Not sure if that's supposed to happen or if it's lack of skill, but ... try throat vibrato unbent. Then bend down all the way and hit it again.
Hope that helps somebody.
Also if anybody sees something im doing wrong let Me know. I'm not sure I've got it right, but it feels pretty right. Definitely an AHAAA Moment. Lol.
----------
"Trust Those Who Seek The Truth. Doubt Those Who Say They Have Found It."
Last Edited by Killa_Hertz on Feb 19, 2016 10:40 AM
|
Killa_Hertz
591 posts
Feb 19, 2016
3:38 PM
|
The 2 hole draw bend is almost like swallowing the bend. It sounds much richer, fuller and more even. The tone change is pretty amazing. It's alot diffetent than the way i usually bend. I'm finding it a little harder with the higher holes. And i usually articulate the 3 hole bends more toward the front so trying to do this in the back is s lil funny.
I'm used to pulling my tongue back and raising it to bend. Now i keep my whole tongue flat and just use the very back.
Idk maybe I'm on to something, maybe I'm crazy. All i know is it sounds much better. It's just harder to control as of yet.
----------
"Trust Those Who Seek The Truth. Doubt Those Who Say They Have Found It."
Last Edited by Killa_Hertz on Feb 19, 2016 3:40 PM
|
Killa_Hertz
592 posts
Feb 19, 2016
3:59 PM
|
There's also this suction i feel. Like a pressure all the way down into my chest. Winslow described this, but i didn't really think it would feel like this. Sorry. I know I'm ranting, but this feels like a pretty big Aha moment. I'm not using any more air but if feels like it. The volume, tone, and pressure have dramatically increased With the same amount of air. Feels like a good bit of pressure built up. Maybe this is why people break so many reeds. Idk. I wish someone would tell me if i were crazy or not.
----------
"Trust Those Who Seek The Truth. Doubt Those Who Say They Have Found It."
|
ME.HarpDoc
123 posts
Feb 24, 2016
9:08 AM
|
Wish I could help Killa but I'm behind you on the learning curve. But for what it's worth, and I say this lovingly, yes in general you are crazy :-) !!
|
Post a Message
|
