arzajac
82 posts
Nov 22, 2009
4:58 AM
|
NarpNinja: "arzajac - does it matter what they would have done? "
Well, then what's the relevance of this discussion? I think every blues artist from the past based they greatness on the past, but somehow reinvented themselves.
As I said, I think there are those who use OBs because they add something to the music and there are those who use them because they can (I.e. "it's wrong to ignore these extra notes").
Can it be argued that overblows were consistently available in the past and all they great players chose not to use them? I mean, if you became that good, it's because you spent a lot of woodshedding time with the instrument and how likely is it that you wouldn't stumble upon the overblow?
And if that's the case, the choice would be to say "This is something I can work with and incorporate into my playing" or to say this is too much work for what it's worth.
I agree with Sirsucksalot - I think they usually sound bad. I think that may be the reason why I can't stand non-blues harp music (I've tried, really!) I really like Adam's use of them - less is more.
And maybe, then, that's the reason Adam's top 10 never used them?
|
HarpNinja
36 posts
Nov 22, 2009
9:02 AM
|
I don't know if the discussion as to whether one should or should not use them is relevant. Like the embouchre discussion, there is no answer. Do or do not.
There is a lot of non-blues harp music sans OBs. Also, there are a lot of musicians who can pick positions, etc. that avoid OBs. OBs are not synonymous with "non-blues" harp music.
----------
Mike Fugazzi
http://www.myspace.com/niterailband
http://www.youtube.com/user/NiteRail
http://www.twitter.com/NiteRail
http://www.facebook.com/mike.fugazzi
|
harpwrench
118 posts
Nov 22, 2009
9:29 AM
|
Sirsucksalot, check the thread "Lee McBee and Joe Spiers". I played the 6OB on "My Babe" at 3:35/3:36, I don't think it sticks out any more than a bent note does.
|
Bb
100 posts
Nov 22, 2009
10:05 AM
|
I'll just say this:
Some players really make OBs work seamlessly into their shit. Like Jason. The sound and the intonation are good. You can still tell where they are sometimes, but they don't stick out.
Other people who are playing them, well, for me I say their OBs are showing. For me it sounds not so good.
Myself, I haven't really chased after OBs 'cause there are so many other things I wanted to work on first that seemed like lower-hanging fruit. But, I do want them. I guess my hope for my own playing is that when I do incorporate them my OBs won't be showing. :^)
-Bob
Last Edited by on Nov 22, 2009 10:08 AM
|
Grillslinger
64 posts
Nov 22, 2009
1:12 PM
|
I've worked on my Lee Oskars to make them more resonsive. I haven't had any trouble or reed tuning ( did break a reed while tuning, but that was me not being careful). I set a couple of them up for overblows. At first I couldn't get them to OB without the squealing. I practiced OB on a Golden Melody for a long time. Recently I picked up one of those LO's and could OB fine without any squealing. The problem had been my technique.
Lee Oskars ARE more prone to squealing with OB's, but it's certainly not impossible.
A.
|
Bb
101 posts
Nov 22, 2009
1:22 PM
|
Joe, your 6OB was very nice.
Lee McBee is fantastic! Wish I could catch him live, rather than just on YouTube. I'm a big fan of what he does.
-Bob
|
harpwrench
119 posts
Nov 22, 2009
1:44 PM
|
Thanks:) Lee might be touring Europe again next year with Mike Morgan, might not be close enough for you though...I'm fortunate to be friends with him, he plays every Sunday night at BB's in Kansas City if he's not somewhere else.
|
Bb
102 posts
Nov 22, 2009
1:56 PM
|
Yeah, I should travel up to KC sometime.
I live in Birmingham, AL so the European tour would be a bit out of my way. :^)
-Bob
|
Sirsucksalot
89 posts
Nov 22, 2009
3:07 PM
|
I don't like how they sound when played by other people. that includes armatures and professionals alike.
|
phogi
124 posts
Nov 22, 2009
3:10 PM
|
I think they the goddamn shiznit. I love how they sound.
|
congaron
296 posts
Nov 23, 2009
12:31 PM
|
My guitar player stuck a short harp lick in the bridge of a song and recorded it on the first album...before i joined the band. He played the lick on a c harp, using notes that sounded good...a simple, cool sounding lick repeated 3 times. No bends 5d--5b--4b-4d-4b-4d-4b....the 4 hole notes are syncopated with the 5 hold notes getting one beat each....this is a one measure lick.
I join the band, learn the song and add my harp to the ENTIRE song. The song is in A. I now play the original one lick using the 4 OB and Bent 3 bent draw on a D harp. 4ob--4d--3db-4b-3db-4b-3db. This allows me to play the entire first half of the song on a D harp. Then I switch to a G harp for a long guitar solo and play in 3rd position to do call and response with the guitar player on some fast ascending licks he does..they are simply three draw notes (7d-9d, think southerd rock guitar triplet pattern 7d-8d-9d x4...5th time 7d--8d-9d-9d)on that harp and I can play them as fast as he can.
I think where I see OBing is the musical instrument side of the discussion. The first time i pulled out my D harp to play cross harp on that song, i couldn't figure out where the lick even was...one month into my harp playing. I actually asked my guitar player what harp he played..."the only one I have...a C harp" was his reply...lol. Exploring this instrument is fascinating to me. I just want to play it in any song I like any time I feel like it. So I study it and practice. I think the whole thing is cool...and i'm 52. Late start, but glad I found it.
Last Edited by on Nov 23, 2009 12:33 PM
|
nineveh_harp
12 posts
Nov 23, 2009
3:19 PM
|
I use 5 and 6 OB occasionally, but not much. I also don't set my harps up for OB's because I don't find that I need to in order to get the OB's that I DO use. I'm mainly a lead guitar player and even though I've been told I'm a good harp player, I just don't find the need to cross the traditional line to get what I'm looking for in my own harp playing. If I did decide to cross that line, and I'm sure I will, then I would definitely take the time to incorperate all the other OB's into my style! That said, I took the time to learn how to overblow so that if I ever wanted to I could. I think that was a wise choice.
-Sam
|
LittleJoeSamson
136 posts
Nov 23, 2009
3:43 PM
|
Overblows are for overblowers.
|
Buzadero
200 posts
Nov 23, 2009
7:31 PM
|
I just hopped back on here after a work absence and a knockout bout with the flu.
The topic line caught my eye first as I scrolled down what I'd missed.
Mike Peloquin hipped me to overblows a few years ago, following a request by me to help me out. You see, I am a harmonica mynah. I am not a "student" per se.
I can hear all the technical/mechanical/clinical descriptions out there, but I tend to work things out by ear. I needed to sit with someone who could hit an overblow on say Hole 4. I would then remember the note and strive to duplicate it. Just like I learned everything else before that. And he did. And I did. Since that time, I have done what everybody else does. That is, I do little exercises in which I consciously work on each hole until I find the spot where my mouth makes it work. In fact, it wasn't until I happened to be fortunate enough to be sitting with Michaelek when he mentioned that the Hole 1 OB could be sustained. This came up during us talking about his recently being contacted by someone (she who shall not be named) that was calling bullshit on a recent comment of his that the Hole 1 OB could be.
We were really talking about online and email attacks more than we were talking about harmonica technique. So, I paused and asked how you could. His reply was by "making your cavity like your about to hold a grapefruit in it". Sounded descriptive at the time. And we continued with our random conversation. Some months later, I'm rolling down the highway playing along on one of my long, multi-hour open highway drives when I got down at the bottom end. That comment popped into my head. My mind thought "grapefruit". And, I'll be damned if over the next ten minutes my fleeting Hole 1 turned into something that I could work like a foghorn. Pretty cool.
That is a bit of a digression on the topic at hand. But, I haven't mentioned it to Chris and I owe him thanks. (I think I owe he and his wife some Vietnamese food as well, but that is even deeper digression).
I have found that for me the natural want to stick an overblow into the progression comes more readily when I'm attempting to hold just one harp in my hand and find common ground with one tune after another as they pop random in a playlist or on the radio. If I'm sticking to the same old tired "tune's in E, grab my A" mind trap, the natural flow of anything other than the odd Hole 5 or 6 OB really doesn't present itself with grace and flow. It always feels forced to me. This is no doubt related directly to my lack of theory. Like I said, I'm a play by feel guy. But, there are plenty of times where I was staunchly and stubbornly sticking to using only a "C" for whatever came on. Quite often at the beginning of these efforts, I would find myself naturally hitting overblows in what felt like almost as frequently as the "regular" notes. Also, very cool. Try it sometime.
Yes. I regularly use overblows.
----------
~Buzadero
Underwater Janitor, Patriot
|
apskarp
60 posts
Nov 23, 2009
10:48 PM
|
I agree Buzadero, I learned OB 1 just like 30 minutes ago and when you hit it feels like you can sustain it forever - actually it really doesn't feel like overblow at all as you can easily add vibrations on it and bend it a little and even articualte it with kah-kah.
The important thing is to have your very back of the mouth in right position. It feels to me that that is where you work at it..
|
Andrew
767 posts
Nov 24, 2009
3:26 AM
|
My first MB in D was set up for a 1OB, but none of my others. Jason is on record as saying he doesn't use it because an unhindered 1 blow is crucial, but since he said that, he's probably had plenty of customs set up for 1 OB. On the other hand, Joe Spiers's video clearly shows him setting up a GM in Bb for a 1 OB.
----------
Kinda hot in these rhinos!
|
